Barter & Trade Items...

Imported items - (coffee, sugar, ect). If the pipelines go down, pipelines from other countries will take much longer to come back. Then there are vises like cigarettes and alcohol.

Toilet paper, face masks, OTC medications, hand cleanser, latex/nitrile gloves.

Knowledge will be in the most demand , doc , nurse, macanic, carpenter, farmer,scientist,

and of course pandemic flu forum folks lol
    

barter was done years ago with smallpox infected blankets, today it's bird flu. contact with others will be like playing Russian roulette. don't gamble with the lives of the little ones.

   Found it!!!

The 100 Items That Will Disappear First In The Potential Collapse
(but not necessarily in the order of their disappearance)

#1. Generators; good ones cost dearly; gas storage is risky; noisy; target of thieves; maintenance, etc.)

#2. Water filters, purifiers

#3. Portable toilets

#4. Seasoned firewood

#5. Lamp oil, wicks, lamps

#6. All types of fuel; Coleman, propane, gasoline, kerosene, diesel.

#7. Guns, ammunition, pepper spray, knives, clubs, bats & slingshots

#8. Hand-can openers & hand egg beaters, whisks

#9. Honey, syrups, white, brown sugars

#10. Rice, beans

#11. Vegetable oil

#12. Charcoal & lighter fluid

#13. Water containers

#14. Mini heater head (Propane)

#15. Grain grinder (non-electric)

#16. Small propane cylinders and the adapter to refill them from the larger size

#17. Goats, chickens, pigeons, ducks, rabbits, milk cows

#18. Mantles: Aladdin, Coleman, etc.

#19. Baby supplies, diapers, formula, ointments, aspirin, etc

#20. Washboards, mop Bucket w/wringer (for laundry)

#21. Cook stoves (Propane, Coleman & Kerosene)

#22. Vitamins (Critical, due to forced daily canned food diets.)

#23. Propane cylinder Handle-Holder. Small canister use is
dangerous without this item.

#24. Feminine hygiene, hair care, skin products

#25. Thermal underwear, tops and bottoms

#26. Bow saws, axes and hatchets & wedges

#27. Aluminum foil reg. & heavy duty

#28. Gasoline containers (plastic or metal)

#29. Garbage bags (impossible to have too many.)

#30. Toilet paper, Kleenex, paper towels

#31. Milk -powdered & condensed (Shake liquid every 3 to 4 months.)

#32. Garden seeds (non-hybrid A MUST)

#33. Clothes pins, line, hangers

#34. Coleman's pump Repair Kit:

#35. Tuna fish (in oil is preferable over water)

#36. Fire extinguishers (or. a large box of baking soda in every room...)

#37. First aid kits

#38. Batteries (all sizes, buy furthest-out for expiration dates)

#39. Garlic, spices & vinegar, baking supplies

#40. BIG dogs (and plenty of dog food)

#41. Flour, yeast & salt

#42. Matches "Strike Anywhere" preferred. Boxed, wooden matches will go first.

#43. Writing paper, pads, pens, pencils, solar calculators

#44. Insulated ice chests (good for keeping items from freezing in wintertime)

#45. Work boots, belts, Levis & durable shirts

#46. Flashlights, light sticks & torches

#47. Journals, diaries & scrapbooks (Jot down ideas, feelings,
experiences: Historic times!)

#48. Garbage cans, plastic (great for storage, water, transporting - if
with wheels)

#49. Men's Hygiene: Shampoo, toothbrush/paste, mouthwash/floss, nail
clippers, etc

#50. Cast iron cookware (sturdy, efficient)

#51. Fishing supplies, tools

#52. Mosquito coils, repellent sprays/creams

#53. Duct tape and WD40 (if it moves, and it is not supposed to, use the duct tape, if it doesn’t move, and it is supposed to, use the WD40)

#54. Tarps, stakes, line

#55. Candles

#56. Laundry detergent (Liquid)

#57. Backpacks & duffle bags

#58. Garden tools & supplies

#59. Scissors, fabrics & sewing supplies

#60. Canned fruits, Veggies, Soups, stews, etc.

#61. Bleach (plain, NOT scented: 4 to 6% sodium hypochlorite)

#62. Canning supplies (Jars/lids/rings/wax)

#63. Knives & sharpening tools: files, stones, steel, oil

#64. Bicycles, tires, tubes, pumps, chains, etc.

#65. Sleeping bags & blankets, pillows, mats

#66. Carbon monoxide alarm (battery powered)

#67. Board games cards, dice

#68. Rat poison, roach killer

#69. Mousetraps, ant traps & cockroach magnets

#70. Paper plates/cups/utensils

#71. Baby wipes, oils, waterless & anti-bacterial soap

#72. Rain gear, rubberized boots, etc.

#73. Shaving supplies (razors & creams, talc, after shave)

#74. Hand pumps & siphons (for water and for fuels)

#75. Soy sauce, vinegar, bouillons, gravy, soup base

#76. Reading glasses

#77. Chocolate, Cocoa, Tang, Punch (water enhancers)

#78 Lanterns, Coleman, kerosene

#79. Woolen clothing, scarves earmuffs, mittens

#80. Hats & cotton neckerchiefs

#81. Gloves, work, warming, gardening and etc.

#82. Graham crackers, saltines, pretzels, trail mix, jerky

#83. Popcorn, peanut butter, nuts

#84. Socks, underwear, t-shirts, etc. (extras)

#85. Lumber (all types)

#86. Wagons & carts (for transport to & from open flea markets)

#87. Cots & inflatable mattresses (for extra guests)

#88. Atomizers (for cooling/bathing)

#89. Wire of all types, bailing, fencing, (barbed and smooth), electrical

#90. Screen patches, glue, nails,

#91. Teas

#92. Coffee

#93. Cigarettes

#94. Wine, liquors (for bribes, medicinal, etc.)

#95. Candies of all kinds

#96. Screws, nuts & bolts

#97. Chewing gum

#98. Any type of food not listed above

#99. All kinds of pharmaceutical supplies

#100. Nails, string, twine, rope, spikes

   Paramedicshappen,

Your welcome.

awww..that smilie looks mean, not the type i was going for...
=\

    Govt has been working to make sure banks and financial institutions function.

No you would get credit for what you have already done. The semester should end in a couple of weeks. You may just have to repeat the next semester (if it starts between Jan. to June.) But the graduation program should be cancelled. Can you imagine all those people? I don't think in many towns it would be, it's too symbolic, and many towns will be in denial. I also face this problem, my son is a senior this year, also.

    Given govt blackout, I am no longer a proponent that despite our prepping we will survive automatically. We won't know what's going on until we see incontravertible evidence in our physical environment, such as large numbers of ill and dead. Remember, I told you about the man who died. Nobody knew he was dead for a week and how they found out I don't know. People are going to die for the most part peacefully in their homes.

Hachiban08, sorry I meant to say it might be cancelled if bf has already started here. I have a feeling they would keep the ceremonies, because like in 1918 they had parades to keep up appearances. But, my son has talked to several teachers about bf. One even gave me a couple of books I didn't have about it. Those teachers have talked to others. The ripple effect will be, that I believe those teachers won't show up when it hits here. School will have to close if a certain amount of teachers are gone (it's the law). It started when I encouraged him to give his assigned speeches on BF, when he could choose the topics. It was slow and took a couple of years, but it worked. Even if our school district doesn't have a plan, at least some of our teachers are well informed with facts about it.

I've read Hammer. I remember how the senator had his men stand out on the road to meet the refugees coming to the senator for help. One guy would stand close to the entrance to the estate and meet the folks. Another would be concealed in the woods with a high-powered rifle. As the people would approach the first guy would listen to any news they had to tell then basically tell them the senator could not help them and to move on. If for any reason he felt threatened he would raise his arms as in surrender. This was the signal for the guy in the woods to shoot. Larry Niven is one of the best.

yep does sound like a WCS. some people may be more panicy with the adrinaline pumping.

i love rice hehe its a staple in japan^_^

hachiban08 wrote: i love rice hehe its a staple in japan^_^

I hear you - chowing down on a big plate of rice and vegetable curry as I type. Couldn't imagine being without it, which might explain why I have about 150 lbs stored away. Barter item? Not sure I'd want to part with any until I was sure there was going to more in the stores. Most of the rice I eat comes from abroad (India usually - I love basmati rice) so I expect it to be very scarce for a long time. In fact, maybe I should buy more...
    

I suspect that if you plan on going out to raid stores, you'll likely get yourself shot as a looter. If it's a major hit akin to 1918 it will be worse than anything any of us has experienced, but it'll be survivable with thorough planning and prepping, rather than resorting to stealing and looting. Hopefully the people on this forum have taken notice of the warning signs and should be getting ready. Wandering the streets after the fact trying to find supplies is a tactic that should be left to the non-preppers. Use the time you have wisely and don't allow yourself to be sideswiped by this thing. Besides, in a pandemic those who didn't prep in advance will undoubtedly already have stripped the stores clean (if the authorities haven't stepped in to prevent looting with curfews and martial law).
In reality, you certainly won't have the luxury of moving the food you need into store freezers and expecting to have sole access to it for years. A very large and hungry population will probably take issue with you on that one. And don't forget that the power outages that just about all the pandemic scenarios predict will make it a moot point anyway. It'll start to thaw and spoil the first time the lights go off, even if it's only for a day or two. Prep now or regret it later.

"One scenario I think we haven't covered yet in after-pandemic is if we have larger numbers of survivors"

The dead will be in the minority - even the worst case scenarios I've seen put global fatalities at around 400 million, which would leave over 6 billion survivors. There'll be a lot of us left to get over this.   
    
    
    
    

I would say yes. The power struggles and passing blame. The bad coodination between the powers that be. Even the red cross had to stop because of lawlessness.

I've read as much as I can on the subject to try and get some idea of how a major pandemic might possibly affect our current way of life. While I'm hoping with all my heart H5N1 will turn out to be a dud that we can look back on and laugh about, I'm trying to prepare for the absolute worst possible scenarios in case it hits us with everything it's got and we're forced to deal with conditions that normally only drought stricken and war torn third world countries encounter. Based on predictions from many sources, in such an eventuality we should absolutely consider the possibility of food and water shortages for extended periods, minimal healthcare, and utilities operating sporadically. However, I don't think I see the same thing you do John. You seem to paint a picture of a dead world along the lines of Omega Man/I am Legend with few survivors. The death toll might well be tremendous if we see something with the lethality of the Spanish Flu, but the odds of surviving would still be greatly in our favor. Even if 1 in 20 succumbed, that would still leave a one in 19 chance of surviving. There is however a good chance that we may find ourselves (at least for a while) living in a society that to all intents and purposes has been kicked back a century or two, and that's what we have to prepare for.
You seem to be relying less on taking advantage of the prior knowledge you have of a possible pandemic and prepping accordingly, and more on food and supplies being available for the taking in empty stores. It won't be like that in my opinion. I think quarantined cities, curfews and martial law are definitely a possibility if rioting gets out of hand (which it undoubtedly will when the hungry masses realise the federal government can't and won't be feeding them), and anyone looting stores will likely be shot on sight or arrested and taken into custody. Then you'll be in a holding cell in close proximity with others who may well be infectious - not good. All the best advice suggests buying in enough supplies for the duration of a pandemic if you can, and sheltering in place. That's a lot of preps and I'm not there yet, but I'm trying. Five years, in my opinion, is an unrealistic number and a lot longer than I think you need to plan for, and my worry is that if we throw time frames like that into the mix we may potentially disillusion new preppers and have them give up before they begin. There will be food, but you won't be able to say with any certainty when it will be available, so you should plan accordingly. I like the idea of trying for three months of self sufficiency, then six, etc. It gives you attainable goals without the burn out factor of going all out for longer periods from the start. We should be basing our prepping - and our advice to others who are new to the idea of a pandemic - on solid science and past experience. Put simply, buy what you need now while you still can, and get ready to sit tight.   
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    
    

I extremely agree with your veiws jacksdad. A lot of my friends dont really believe that bird flu is even a real threat at all. so i tell them about all that is going on and show them the reasearch and i got a few to understand the severity of the matter. Some however, dont believe it so i feel for them. My friend and I are discussing what else to put in our preps,but we both have a family of 3 so what do we do with that? How much of stuff for each person and for how long. since we are still in high school and neither of us have jobs*but are looking*, its hard for us to prep well but we DO try. So what kinda of prepping advice do you give us considering our circumstances?
    

ok Jacksdad...tell me when you first started...what have you learned? Another question...I got a foodsaver for Christmas..how long can dog food last in those packages? Would it be safe to go ahead and seal up some food for my dogs now? Also..I understand what you mean about trying to tell people...Ive just gotten disgusted with it..so I go on...then they say Ill be at your house if it hits...and I tell them, you may make it to the porch but I wont be sharing, Ill shoot!! I do have one friend that is as serious as I am about it and we have discussed these people at length...

She just said the other day, "You know these people that refuse to do anything for themselves will be the first one with a hand out when it gets bad", and she is right!!! this has kind of made me angry cause, I know it will happen. I dont discuss it anymore because Im like you...I dont want people thinking they can just come to my house..What I take the time to do for me and my family is just that.

See I think once it goes to phase 4 all these people are going to start scrambling...and there will be a shortage of everything...prices will go up...what we are paying $1.50 for soup today will be sold for $5.00 when this happens...My thing is Im just trying to find the space for everything...and you dont want to attract pest...so I'm working on it...I have some things but not like some of you guys that have months worth! I have about a months worth of food and not nearly enough of water...but I will keep doing it...maybe I will get there...by the way...Im starting to keep a spread sheet so that I will know what I have on hand at all times.

    jacksdad-I see what you are saying. My closest friends are the only ones who seem to take interest in what i have to say because i am probably the wisest of my friend considering they come to me w/ help for their problems. Yea only the friend i was talking about and i are prepping. she is also my only friend that knows of my preps. Would a place like Winco be good because they also sell bulk food. Wow the rice here in the central valley,California is i think like $3 for 5 pounds. I'd be poor tryna get some rice=[ and i LOVE rice. My other friend works at her family's meat locker and gives me like a pound of beef jerky every so often even though it costs $10 per pound. She gives it to me for free. So should i stock up on what she gives me? How long does it last? So buying in bulk helps you save $$?Can it be put in a normal ziplock bag or some special type of bag?
Yes, every time longs drugs has a sale on pork n beans or canned hormel tamales, i get some, i currently have i think 20 cans of those.i just have one bag of flour tho. Can those nutrigrain bars be useful? Sorry for so many questions =\

hachi...ziplock has come out with their own vacuum pack bags and gadget...the machine is $10.00 and then they sell the bags...if you wanted to get some bags of rice and pasta, you could maybe seal those...I know this might sound crazy but every time I go to a restaurant I ask for extra..ketchup, taco sauce, salt pepper etc...and I put it in my stash...Dont forget the reason for using paper plates and cups is to make your water stretch farther. Im going to use under my beds as storage for can goods and sealed food.

One other thing I thought I would pass on is...back in the old days they kept beds warm with rocks that they had in the fire...they would wrap it up in covers and put it in the bed...it would keep the bed toasty all night...I know it sounds crazy...but if it keeps you from freezing to death I guess it would be ok...just dont burn yourself getting the rock out of the fire!!!!

If you have pets...here is an idea...Im going to take what I normally feed tem in a day and (dry food) and seal it in bags for each day...that way I will know how many days of supplies I have...you can use Ziplocks for this or a foodsaver....