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Is Egypt a Microcosm for 2011?

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Poll Question: Is Egypt a Microcosm for 2011?
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9 [14.29%]

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Mahshadin View Drop Down
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    Posted: January 29 2011 at 9:16am
 
 
 
Short Video Coverage
 
 

Egyptian protesters regroup after day of rage

President Mubarak is clinging to power in Egypt as groups form demanding an end to his 30-year-rule.

Mubarak ordered troops and tanks into the capital Cairo and other cities overnight and imposed a curfew in an attempt to quell protests that have shaken the Arab world's most populous nation, a key US ally, to the core.

Despite dozens of deaths in Friday's clashes, people turned out in the streets Saturday in defiance of security forces and said they would carry on protesting until Mubarak quits.

"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Universal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 29 2011 at 12:39pm
Will the US stand on the side of countires whose people want freedom and not dictatorship or will it stand on the side of its political interest?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 29 2011 at 1:50pm

USA Political Interests  (Egypt is a big one)

 

USA and other Western Interests are actually a pretty big deal here. Between the Suez canal and the Sumed pipeline both in Egypt which account for the movement of over 7 Million Barrels of Oil  A Day (Black Gold), not to mention a crucial transport route for the US Navy.

 

Another noteworthy fact:

Egypt is and has also been for some time on the Top 5 List of Foreign Aid Dollars along side Israel (Over a Billon A Year).

 
I would imagine their are many nervous people and politicians around the world waiting and wondering what do and waiting to see what will unfold in this key area of the World
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 29 2011 at 5:59pm
I think it goes far deeper than that Universal.

If Egypt falls, who then takes control?

If Egypt falls, what happens to the Suez Canal? Take into account that a quarter to a third of all the energy in the world flows through there.

The Egyptian people are angry at a range of issues, some are easily fixed, i.e. Democracy/Representative Government. Others are more difficult, i.e. cost of food, jobs, cost of education, etc. which the Government has no, and can't have control over outside of not overinflating currency (Take heed Mr. Obama) What's going to happen when these issues continue or are made worse?

If Egypt falls, understand that they are really the only area ally Israel has. Will the new leadership be as intelligent as the current one? By that I mean averting a nuclear exchange or worse, a regional arms race culminating in a full exchange. The last time the Arab world seriously tangled with Israel, they got curbstomped. (The Six Day War. The deal where they shot up Lebanon was not serious)

So, knowing this, the U.S. has to weigh the options and go with the least of evils. My take is that we should stay out of it and see what happens, for good or bad.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views. - William F. Buckley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 29 2011 at 6:42pm
Trubo is correct...if the Suez Canal falls into the wrong hands get your bikes out. I lived through the oil embargo it was a mess and today it would be 1,000 times worse. I thank the lord that I have a car that gets 28 miles to a gallon, I work 3 miles from my house, the grocery store is 3 blocks away as well as my grocery store, Walgreens, and my son's job and school.

I will get baskets for our bikes and lose weight as I bike everywhere, except in winter when I use my 28mpg car!

I do not believe Obama and his advisors will handle this well, we will be in trouble soon I fear.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TipKat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 29 2011 at 8:20pm

All good points everyone! Thank you all! Clap

I also want to mention that there are other nations/countries in the middleast that are having problems of their own with their government.  First it started with the uprising in Tunsia, Yemen, Egypt and now Algiers has started their own protests.  This might be a start of something too huge to calm and how this will affect all intrests around the globe well....ONly time will tell.  TipKat 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2011 at 6:59pm
WOW
 
Still spiralling out of control on Sunday, tomorrow should be interesting. People in the streets with baseball bats and kitchen knives defending their homes. Mohamed Mustafa ElBaradei (IAEA) shows up on Sunday to rally the crowd at Liberty Square and call for  Mubarak to step down.
 
I guess this would qualify as the first major International Problem for 2011.
 
Worst case Scenario
Islamic Fundamentalists (Muslim Brotherhood) take control of Egypt and ends Peace Treaty with Israel, and takes control of the Suez canal/Sumed pipeline with 4 to 6 million barrels of oil moving through daily.
 
Shocked
 
Wo, am I just being paranoid?
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How much will the Market Tumble Tomorrow?
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2011 at 10:24pm
Originally posted by Mahshadin Mahshadin wrote:

WOW
 
Still spiralling out of control on Sunday, tomorrow should be interesting. People in the streets with baseball bats and kitchen knives defending their homes. Mohamed Mustafa ElBaradei (IAEA) shows up on Sunday to rally the crowd at Liberty Square and call for  Mubarak to step down.
 
I guess this would qualify as the first major International Problem for 2011.
 
Worst case Scenario
Islamic Fundamentalists (Muslim Brotherhood) take control of Egypt and ends Peace Treaty with Israel, and takes control of the Suez canal/Sumed pipeline with 4 to 6 million barrels of oil moving through daily.
 
Shocked
 
Wo, am I just being paranoid?
___________________________
 
How much will the Market Tumble Tomorrow?
 


All good questions.

No easy answers.

My guess is that the market will drop maybe 100, oil prices are going to jump around $4/barrel.

I'll add to your worst case scenario that the Islamic Fundamentalists side with Iran and ignore the whole Arab vs Persian thing to get at Israel.

I'd get a kick out of watching Israel whip all comers at the same time.

Current Oil Price per barrel = $89.55

Minimum buy-in for crude is $10,000 worth.

Hypothetical:
So let's say we all pitch in and buy $10,000 right this second. We'll get 112 barrels, give or take. We sell tomorrow night. Any guesses on whether we make or lose money? This should be interesting!
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views. - William F. Buckley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 6:45am
I do not believe Obama and his advisors will handle this well, we will be in trouble soon I fear.


I agree with you flumom...I think that the xxxx is starting to hit the fan..


Clinton convenes mass meeting of US ambassadors

www.google.com

    WASHINGTON (AP) — Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton is convening an unprecedented mass meeting of U.S. ambassadors.

    The top envoys from nearly all of America's 260 embassies, consulates and other posts in more than 180 countries will be gathering at the State Department beginning on Monday. Officials say it's the first such global conference.

(visit the link for the full news article)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Universal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 7:13am
Coyote, Clinton is most likely meeting with amabassadors over the Wikileaks fallout.

TG, I don't think it's simple at all. Do we support the seemingly democratic revolution against a government we support in the war with terror or not? if we do, other Middle East nations wil see us as backstabbers. We can't afford that. I think Obama has been doing a decent job so far of balancing these issues. He should tell Muraback to step down soon if the tension escalates.   I heard that the top military brass of Egypt was meeting at the pentagon when the crises happened and were told by their pentagon counterparts to exercise restraint. That seems to be what's happening now. The military is playing it calmly. And I believe its because their military listens to us as we are there number one contributer of military aid.   If the military does nothing and the uprising continues, with or without muraback willing to step down, the people will eventually take over.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 10:08am
Originally posted by Universal Universal wrote:

Coyote, Clinton is most likely meeting with amabassadors over the Wikileaks fallout.
 
Doubtful. I think that boat has sailed. Unless Wikileaks releases something else interesting, they're going to get back burnered.
Originally posted by Universal Universal wrote:


TG, I don't think it's simple at all. Do we support the seemingly democratic revolution against a government we support in the war with terror or not? if we do, other Middle East nations wil see us as backstabbers. We can't afford that. I think Obama has been doing a decent job so far of balancing these issues. He should tell Muraback to step down soon if the tension escalates.   I heard that the top military brass of Egypt was meeting at the pentagon when the crises happened and were told by their pentagon counterparts to exercise restraint. That seems to be what's happening now. The military is playing it calmly. And I believe its because their military listens to us as we are there number one contributer of military aid.   If the military does nothing and the uprising continues, with or without muraback willing to step down, the people will eventually take over.
 
Ahh, but that's the rub, Universal. I remember a bunch of Muslim youngsters doing exactly what's happening in Egypt, in their country back in the seventies. They wanted jobs, they wanted expanded freedom, and especially represenative government.
 
That country is Iran.
 
Rarely, very, very rarely does a country that topples their government through what's happening now, or through violence, become more free. I can think of only one example, and we're in it, and that's only because George Washington had a concience. They invariably wind up under a dictatorial style of leadership, and in Muslim countries, under a fundamentalist Islamic dictator. Now that the Muslim Brotherhood is in this mess the likelihood of reform for the better is dwindling. My prediction is that if it falls now, they'll be a second Yemen/Iran. Either unable to squash the cancer of extremist Islam, or will be an antagonistic force in the area.
 
Now I'm not saying we should interviene, not at all, no matter which way it goes, unless they get the idea it'd be fun to close the Suez Canal, which some are talking about doing if they get their way. Now my personal preference is that I want Egypt to fall, turn hardline extremist, close the Suez Canal, run oil to $300 a barrel, and gas to 15/gallon so I can watch the cities burn when the welfare checks run out and there's no food on the shelves to buy it with. I doubt that's going to happen though. There's enough players around the world that might take offense to this that will interveine.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views. - William F. Buckley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Universal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 12:57pm
Just to understand you better TG; when you say cities, you are referring to our own or Egypts? Can you clarify?
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Ours.

If the bribery to not riot checks run out (Welfare) and there's no food on the shelves to buy it with, American cities will burn. We've concentrated our poor into just about 3% of America, and those are the cities.

Last time oil was high, gas only got to $4.75 or so. If it jumps to $200 to $300 a barrel it's going to be $7 or $8 a gallon if $200/barrel oil, and if $300/barrel it'll be closer to $17 a gallon. That is an economic killswitch. $4.75 a gallon gas just about knocked our economy out. At $17 much less $7 a gallon trucks can no longer haul and our food stores absolutely rely on trucks to get the grub from the train station to the supermarket. If that is even slightly curtailed, say 10%, the store starts running out of food.

Considering that most poor in the cities have maybe, MAYBE, a day or two of food in their houses, if there's any supply interruption or slowdown, people are going to run out of food, and the cities will burn.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 4:28pm
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 5:51pm
Well
 
Stocks up, Gold Down, Oil Up
 
WackoWackoWacko
__________________________________ 
 
 
 
Boy there are no good choices as of yet, other than just staying on the sidelines not giving a clear American Choice which would more than likely en-flame the masses considering the 30 year shaking of hands and looking the other way
 
________________________________________________  
Estimate 50,000 to 75,000 or more Americans Living in Egypt 
 
American Evacuation begins: 900 today flown out (in addition to commercial flights), 1500 or more tomorrow, and more flights to other cities in the next few days, with 2 Navy ships on standby in the red sea which could be used for evacuation efforts if needed. 
 
Marines and agents sent on security mission to American Embassy In Egypt
(How would you like to be on that mission TG?) (Could still go either way)
___________________________________________________________ 
 
What A Mess
 
Doesnt matter how you flip it (Its Still A Mess)
 
 
 
 
 
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Ok, why are Americans leaving Egypt by the droves if there is no huge problem. There has been another travel advisory about terror attacks in Britan and other countries. Clinton is not worried about Wikileaks...give me a break. Clinton is meeting with the Ambassadors because Egypt is a real threat to the U.S. economic stability.

This overthrow could mean huge hikes in gas prices which means any recovery for the U.S. economy is dead in the water. I lived through the Oil Crisis in the 1970's and this was a very dark time for the economy.

You young kids out there in your 20,30's and 40's are you willing to sit in a gas line for 2-4 hours and pay $5-7 or more for a gallon of gas. Think about how much plastic will go up, cost of food, cost of clothing, just to name a few things that "oil" will affect. Inflation was out of control in the 1970's with the Oil Embargo. You kids think things are bad now, LOL you ain't seen nothing yet!

Egypt has no oil but it protects the tranportation and shipping of oil in the whole region. So if they close the Suez Canal we are in a world of hurt! We should have been drilling on land in all the oil pools in Texas, the Baken Oil pool and Alaska to have our own oil. We are fools!

I am going to stock up in the next two weeks since we are in for a very bad ride and anyway...Dec. 21, 2012 is coming up fast. So I am prepping on many levels.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2011 at 9:37pm
Tomorrow gonna be a gamebreaker I think
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 5:03am
Mubarak has Barbed Wire Barrier put up around his residence in Cairo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 8:28am
Originally posted by Mahshadin Mahshadin wrote:

Mubarak has Barbed Wire Barrier put up around his residence in Cairo
 
If I were in his shoes, I would too.
 
Razorwire, and claymores maybe.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 8:56am
Jordons Monarch (King)
 
Fires the Government and asks EX Army General to form a new Cabinet after similar protests in the streets
______________________________________________________
 
Sound Familiar?
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Universal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 9:25am
Ok TG, I don't know about your analyses but the more important question is why you want to see our cities burnt to the ground?   Bored?

FM, Time to buy an electric car or a hybrid, time to take the bike to do the shopping. Hopefully if things like plastic become more expensive people won't use them and will force a more green alternative.   
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Originally posted by Universal Universal wrote:

Ok TG, I don't know about your analyses but the more important question is why you want to see our cities burnt to the ground?   Bored?
 
Combination of boredom and a desire to get to see defecation hit oscillation. Oh and I want to see how people handle themselves when their milk ticket is cut. There's just too many leeches sucking off the system. It's about time.
 
We've been forced to pay bribery to these people so they won't riot. I want them to. They'll burn themselves out of their own homes, and have no place else to go and then they'll cease to be a problem.
 
When it happens I'll be the guy on my roof wearing a pair of socks, a star wars tee shirt and a viking cap shooting off bottle rockets!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joe Neubarth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 12:41pm
As of now, it looks like Mubarak may have headed off the enemy at the pass.  By promising to step down in the Fall, he puts his adversaries in the position of planning What If strategy.  There is less impetus to riot.  Hopefully it works.  Riots will only result in Radical Islam taking over the country.  The Western World can not have that, so you would see some sort of dollar brokered military takeover.< id="gwProxy" ="">< ="ifofjsCall==''jsCall;elsesetTimeout'jsCall',500;" id="jsProxy" ="">
Total truth at all times. Why do people have problems with the truth?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HappyHeart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 12:51pm
From the Media... reports are that the Muslim Brotherhood is the only opposition group with organizational skills to run Egypt if Mubarak steps down.  If this is true I fear for the world and its global implications. 
 
A global Caliphate, ruled by sharia law. The Muslim Brotherhood has had as their stated goal since 1925.
 
The Muslim Brotherhood on Sunday announced its support for El Baradei as a "transitional" president. Both El Baradei and the Muslim Brotherhood are backed by Iran.
 
Taquiya.....what is it about deception to achieve a means to an end.
 
Muslim Brotherhood: 'Prepare Egyptians for war with Israel'
 
 

02/01/2011 02:00 
 
A leading member of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt told the Arabic-language Iranian news network Al-Alam on Monday that he would like to see the Egyptian people prepare for war against Israel, according to the Hebrew-language business newspaper Calcalist.

Muhammad Ghannem reportedly told Al- Alam that the Suez Canal should be closed immediately, and that the flow of gas from Egypt to Israel should cease “in order to bring about the downfall of the Mubarak regime.” He added that “the people should be prepared for war against Israel,” saying the world should understand that “the Egyptian people are prepared for anything to get rid of this regime.”

Ghannem praised Egyptian soldiers deployed by President Hosni Mubarak to Egyptian cities, saying they “would not kill their brothers.” He added that Washington was forced to abandon plans to help Mubarak stay in power after “seeing millions head for the streets.”
  
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 1:44pm
Ask the Egyptians how that whole attacking Israel thing worked out for them back in that whole "Six Day War."
 
To put it simply: They got the holy bajeezus shot out of them. Round two would be an even better curbstomping.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Universal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 6:04pm
Cool, can I hang? I'll be the guy with the buck antlers, only wearing a tie, and the sign that says " Obamacare is a gateway drug"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 6:11pm

Hosni Mubarak's Speech to Egypt on February 1

(FULL TEXT)Translation

 
Fellow citizens, I speak to you in very difficult times - Egypt and its people were tested and we were thrown into the unknown. The homeland is undergoing critical events and difficult tests, which have started with honest young people and citizens. They have the right for peaceful demonstrations to express their worries, but they were exploited very quickly by those who wanted to manipulate the situation to create chaos and destroy the constitution.
 
These demonstrations moved from a civilized expression of practicing freedom of speech to sad confrontations which were organized by political groups who wanted to throw fire on the oil and to threaten the stability, and provoke, and create looting and destruction and fires, and to block roads, and to attack national possessions and public and private possessions, and attacks on some diplomatic missions on Egypt.

We are living together in difficult days, and what hurts our hearts the most and the fear which has overtaken most Egyptians and the anxiety which has overtaken them regarding what tomorrow will bring for them and their families and the future and destiny of their country.

 
The events of the last few days impose on us all, as people and as a leadership, choosing between chaos and stability and brings in front of us new circumstances and a different Egyptian reality, which our people and our army must deal with in the most wise ways in order to protect Egypt's interests and its children.
 
My brother and sisters, citizens, I have initiated the formation of a new government with new priorities and initiatives which will respond to our young people's demands and their anxieties. And in dialogue with all political forces, we have discussed all the issues that have been raised regarding democratic and political reforms and constitutional changes  -- which will be required in order to fulfill these legitimate demands and the restoration of stability and security.

But there are political forces who have rejected this invitation for dialogue, holding on to their private agendas, and without concern for Egypt's situation, and with their rejection for my invitation to dialogue -- which still stands.

I will directly speak to my people, from its peasants, workers, Muslims, and cooks, its old people and its young people, and to all Egyptian men and women in the countryside and in the cities across the land, and in all the districts. I never wanted power or prestige, and people know the difficult circumstances in which I shouldered the responsibility and what I have given to the homeland during war and during the peace.

I am also a man of the army, and it is not in my nature to give up responsibility. My first responsibility now is to restore the security and stability of the homeland, to achieve a peaceful transition of power in an environment that will protect Egypt and Egyptians, and which will allow for responsibility to be given to whoever the people will elect in the forthcoming elections.

I will say with all honesty -- and without looking at this particular situation -- that I was not intent on standing for the next elections, because I have spent enough time in serving Egypt, and I am now careful to conclude my work for Egypt by presenting Egypt to the next government in a constitutional way which will protect Egypt.

I want to say in clear terms that, in the next few months that are remaining of my current term, I will work very hard to carry out all the necessary measures to transfer power to the authorized legitimate.

The constitutional articles 67 and 77  should be changed to allow very specific periods for presidency, and in order for the parliament to be able to discuss these constitutional changes and the legislative changes which -- of the laws linked to the constitution, and in order to guarantee that all political powers will contribute to these discussions, I ask of the parliament to commit to speed up the elections.

I will pursue the transfer of power in a way that will fulfill the people's demands and that this new government will fulfill the people's demands and their hopes for political, economic and social progress, and for the provision of employment opportunities and fighting poverty and achieving social justice.

And in this context, I want to ask the police to carry out their role in protecting the citizens honestly and to respect their rights and freedoms and their dignity.

I also want to ask censorship authorities and legislative authorities to carry out immediately every measure to pursue those who are corrupt and those who have been responsible for what has happened of all the destructive acts and looting and fires that have taken place in Egypt. This is my promise for the people during the next few months that remain of my current leadership. I ask of God that he will help me to do my job in a way that will be satisfactory to God and to my homeland and its people.

Egypt will come out of these difficult circumstances stronger than it used to be before, more confident, more united, and more stable. Our people will become much more aware of its own self- interests and more careful not to sacrifice its destiny and its stability.

Hosni Mubarak, who's speaking to you today, is proud of all the long years he's spent in the service of people of Egypt. This dear country is my country, just like it is the homeland of every Egyptian man and woman.

I have lived in this country. I have fought for it. I have defended its sovereignty and interest, and I will die on its land, and history will judge me and others.

The homeland will remain, and people will disappear, and Egypt will always remain, and its flag will always be high. And it is our duty to achieve this with dignity and honor, generation after generation.

May God protect this homeland and its people, and peace be upon you, and God's mercy and blessings.

END

 
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 6:56pm
< =480 => < = =text/>
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2011 at 9:14pm

Clever

Opposition has played their largest card

Followed by A Proud Egyptian Speech
 
Next Up Pro Mubarek Protests
 
This has been a crazy week+
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 5:18am
Violence Breaks Out between Pro and Opposition Protesters
 
Getting Ugly!!
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 6:15am
Originally posted by Universal Universal wrote:

Cool, can I hang? I'll be the guy with the buck antlers, only wearing a tie, and the sign that says " Obamacare is a gateway drug"
 
You God damn right you can!
 
I'd specifically expect it!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 7:11am
Originally posted by Mahshadin Mahshadin wrote:

Violence Breaks Out between Pro and Opposition Protesters
 
Getting Ugly!!
 
Yeah Mahshadin, I don't think this is going to end well. 
 
I'm starting to suspect that we're going to have another extremist Muslim country on our hands when all is said and done.
 
Then we're going to have to worry what they're going to do in regards to Israel...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote endman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 1:51pm
Egyptians are saying that they are sick and tired on one party roll that has lost the touch with common people. The news is saying that the other Arab governments should be taking notice and maybe start implementing reforms. And what about us we are in no better shape here either. Two party governments are not a solution and people are getting sick from it too.  If oil goes up above $300 and dollar falls we will see people on the streets too.
And yes Chevy Volt, dose anybody knows who makes the main component for this car no not the engine
The battery?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 3:34pm
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 4:04pm

Yemen's President Ali Abdullah Saleh says he won't run in 2013 elections

Before a day of planned protests, Yemen's President Ali Abdullah Saleh says he won't seek another term and his son won't be his successor.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-yemen-president-20110203,0,4058776.story?track=rss

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 4:21pm
Originally posted by Turboguy Turboguy wrote:

Originally posted by Mahshadin Mahshadin wrote:

Violence Breaks Out between Pro and Opposition Protesters
 
Getting Ugly!!
 
Yeah Mahshadin, I don't think this is going to end well. 
 
I'm starting to suspect that we're going to have another extremist Muslim country on our hands when all is said and done.
 
Then we're going to have to worry what they're going to do in regards to Israel...
______________________________________________________  
 
If we could only convince them to add to their Constitution:
 
SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
No Real Democracy or Freedom Without That
 
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 7:10pm
Molotov cocktail battles on the streets
 
Sustained Gunfire in and Around Liberty Square
 
Pro and Opposing forces fight for high ground overlooking Liberty Square
 
People being taken into custody on the street and interigated
 
Some fires still burning
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turboguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2011 at 7:53pm
Originally posted by Mahshadin Mahshadin wrote:

Originally posted by Turboguy Turboguy wrote:

Originally posted by Mahshadin Mahshadin wrote:

Violence Breaks Out between Pro and Opposition Protesters
 
Getting Ugly!!
 
Yeah Mahshadin, I don't think this is going to end well. 
 
I'm starting to suspect that we're going to have another extremist Muslim country on our hands when all is said and done.
 
Then we're going to have to worry what they're going to do in regards to Israel...
______________________________________________________  
 
If we could only convince them to add to their Constitution:
 
SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
No Real Democracy or Freedom Without That
 


QFT (Quoted For Truth)

FunFact - That clause isn't in our Constitution either! It simply states that there'll be no ESTABLISHMENT of religion, i.e. telling everyone they MUST be Protestant.

In a Muslim country it is ABSOLUTELY necessary or you have morons like the Taliban in Afghanistan blowing up statues made a millenia before Islam because they wrongly believe that noting predates Islam! They're like those 6000 year old Earth Christians. Or Hassidics howling that they don't need weapons, yet at the same time howling that they be protected by the IDF and THEIR weapons...

While I'm glad they wrongly attribute the Separation of Church and State to our Constitution, I think the ACLU and others are taking that little deal a bit too far. That's a debate for another thread, however.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views. - William F. Buckley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 03 2011 at 3:48pm
Looks mlike the press is now being restricted. Went from 2 or three live feeds 2 days ago to short clips today, coulnt find a live feed anywhere.
 

HMMM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 03 2011 at 6:43pm

Interesting article/not sure on website

___________________________________________

Thursday, February 3, 2011

Israel beefs up troops on Egyptian border

 
Israel's military has increased its presence on the border with Egypt over fears that terrorists and migrants will take advantage of the unrest in Egypt to cross into Israel.

The army and border police also are concerned that large groups of Bedouins living in the Sinai will attempt to flee into Israel.

Egypt moved 800 troops into the Sinai on Jan. 31 to quell Bedouin riots, the Israeli daily Ha�aretz reported, part of the demonstrations throughout the country calling for the ouster of Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak. The movement of troops into Sinai, which is a violation of the peace accord between Israel and Egypt, reportedly was undertaken with Israel's permission. --jta


http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/60724/israel-beefs-up-troops-on-egyptian-border
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Grand Theft Auto Cairo!

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a8f_1296761547

This is a great video. I'll bet this person gets at least fifteen confirmed in this bowling strike!
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views. - William F. Buckley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote endman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2011 at 8:12am
.S., China Firms To Make Electric-Car Batteries in Ohio

California-based electric-car startup Coda Automotive plans to build a factory in Ohio that it said could employ more than 1,000 workers and that will use Chinese technology to produce automotive-grade lithium-ion batteries for an all-electric car Coda plans to launch in California later this year.

The deal is a rare example of a U.S. auto maker having to tap a Chinese company for advanced technology. Another unusual facet of the venture is the planned creation of manufacturing jobs both in China and the U.S.

Closely held Coda, which announced the move Tuesday, will final-assemble the electric car at a facility in the greater Los Angeles area with component modules produced in China. It will initially make the car available only in California, where it is targeting sales of 14,000 electric sedans by the end of 2011.

Initially, Coda plans to bring in batteries from Tianjin, China, where Coda recently opened a battery plant it jointly owns and runs with Tianjin Lishen Battery Joint-Stock Co. That plant has capacity to produce more than 20,000 battery packs a year, but because electric-car-grade, lithium-ion batteries are heavy and expensive to ship across the Pacific, Coda has been searching for a production site in the U.S..

The Santa Monica, Calif., company said it is still considering several sites within Ohio for the facility. Construction of the facility is also "contingent upon finalizing an incentive package with the state of Ohio and the approval of an application for a loan from the Department of Energy," which the company said it plans to submit soon.

Few details are known about Coda's financials; the company said in March that together with Lishen it had raised $100 million in committed capital for its joint venture in Tianjin. Its board of advisers includes Henry Paulson, the former U.S. Treasury Secretary and CEO of Goldman Sachs, who also has taken an undisclosed stake in the company.

While the basic technology for lithium-ion batteries have been around for a while, technology to make batteries safe enough to be used to power cars has proved elusive. A few years ago when Coda began designing the all-electric sedan, "there were no U.S. suppliers of [large, vehicle-grade] battery systems, period," Coda Chief Executive Kevin Czinger said in an interview in Tianjin over the weekend, prompting Coda to look to China.

"We found luckily a great partner that was very open-minded and said let's work together on your technology," he said.

Lishen, already an established supplier of lightweight batteries for Apple Inc.'s iPhone and iTouch devices, "fully supports our decision" to build a manufacturing plant in the U.S. rather than producing those batteries in China and exporting them to the U.S., said Mr. Czinger, who like Mr. Paulson has a professional past at Goldman Sachs.

"We are really an example of how to do this: how China and the U.S. can work together and accelerate the creation and adoption of a new technology and build jobs in both places in a balanced and harmonious way."

Mr. Czinger said Coda will be the controlling shareholder of the battery-production venture in Ohio. Lishen, he said, is expected to take a "small minority interest" in the venture.

The knowhow involved in coming up with an automotive-grade battery is one of the most critical in making an electric car attractive to everyday consumers by giving it a relatively long driving range. Coda said its compact all-electric sedan will have a driving range, depending on individual driving habits, of 100-120 miles on a single, full charge.

Coda said that at a price of around $35,000 after about $7,000 to $7,500 of federal tax incentives, it expects the car to compete with electric battery cars like the $32,780 Nissan Leaf sedan, which Japan's Nissan Motor Co. plans to launch in the U.S. in December.

Mr. Czinger said Coda aims to "replicate" in Ohio the Coda-Lishen manufacturing plant in Tianjin, which he showed off this weekend to visiting U.S. Commerce Secretary Gary Locke. The proposed U.S. plant is expected to eventually create "thousands of jobs," he said.

"Energy is a $6 trillion global market," said Mr. Locke in a news conference in Tianjin Saturday. "The United States and China are leaders in clean energy, and we simply must work together more than we have ever before, so that we can sustain long-term economic growth in each of our countries and create more jobs."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mahshadin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2011 at 2:06pm

Can there be Freedom and Democracy for all in Egypt without seperation of Church & State ?????

How about the people below

I f Islam takes control politically then one mans morality will be legislated over another (Is that Freedom)

____________________________________________________________________

 

Egypt's Coptic Christians fear life without Mubarak

By Edmund Sanders, Los Angeles Times February 3, 2011

The Copts have protested the harassment directed at them under the Egyptian president's rule, but worry that things would be far worse if Islamist extremists gained power.

Coptic%20Christians

Coptic Christian pro-government supporters march in Cairo, Egypt. (Patrick Baz / AFP/Getty Images)

 
Reporting from Alexandria, Egypt —
The morning bells of All Saints Church beckon worshipers a little later these days, and Mass is celebrated more frequently.

The schedule shift for the early service has come in response to the government-imposed overnight curfew. The extra services? Coptic Christians in Egypt's second-largest city say they have a lot of reasons to pray amid the nation's ongoing turmoil.

But in a surprise even to them, many Copts say they now find themselves praying for President Hosni Mubarak's government to last as long as possible.
 
It's not that the Copts — who make up about 10% of Egypt's population of more than 80 million — see the autocratic three-decade president as a great friend. Far from it, they say. As recently as last month, Christian youths in this coastal city protested what they called the government's failure to root out growing anti-Copt harassment, which culminated in a New Year's Day bombing that killed 24 worshipers outside All Saints.

Weeks before anti-Mubarak demonstrators in Cairo began their occupation of Tahrir Square, Copt protesters in Alexandria were choking on tear gas as they faced down government police.

But now, many say they're rethinking their opposition to Mubarak's government, fearing its collapse might spur an anti-Christian backlash if the Muslim Brotherhood or other Islamist groups gain a foothold.

"He's the best of the worst," said Sameh Joseph, a church worker at the Patriarch of the Orthodox Christians Church in Alexandria. "Whoever comes after him might want to destroy us."

So when more than 100,000 anti-government protesters took to the streets here Tuesday, most Copts steered clear.

"Everyone is scared about what is happening," said Samya Hammoui, who lost two sisters and two nieces in the Jan. 1 bombing. Government officials blamed the attack on a Palestinian terrorist cell from the Gaza Strip.

"If one of the Islamic extremists took over, things for us would be much worse," she said.

In contrast to their criticism of Mubarak after the bombing, Christian leaders in Egypt have more recently been stressing the need to maintain order.

On Sunday, Coptic Pope Shenouda III said on government-run television that Egyptians should "safeguard the security and stability of the country."

The government began beefing up security around churches after the bombing, but when the pro-Mubarak police walked off the job last week, church officials scrambled to fill the void.

At All Saints, guards check worshipers at the door and an ambulance stands ready in the courtyard, parked under a poster of Jesus.

There have been no reports of attacks on Copts in Alexandria since the anti-government protests began, though after the Jan. 1 bombing, Christians and Muslims clashed briefly on the streets.

The recent unrest may actually be working to bring the two sides together, officials of the church said, at least in the short term.

Outside the Patriarch church near the city center, a vigilante squad of mostly Muslims is now protecting the facility at night. Similar teams are set up at churches around the city.

"Muslims and Christians are brothers," said Mohamed Elnokary, 40, holding a wooden club as he inspected cars this week at a checkpoint outside Patriarch. "No one is going to divide us."

Working by his side was Mina Fakhry, 25, a Coptic Christian who owns a nearby clothing shop. The two men say they've had no problems working together, despite the fact that they disagree fervently about whether Mubarak should quit.

Elnokary wants to see the president leave, blaming him for the country's economic stagnation. Fakhry shrugged and said: "I guess he's not so bad. He could stay."

Several Copts acknowledged that their newfound appreciation for Mubarak was based largely on their confidence in his ability to maintain order and keep Islamist extremists at bay.

Nevertheless, Copts have faulted the government for failing to stop a string of attacks over the last year, which also included a Christmas Eve drive-by shooting that killed six of them. A bishop has also been threatened, and Christians have been publicly derided for allegedly holding converts to Islam "hostage." They've also been blamed for bringing swine flu to Egypt.

"All this kept happening and the president did nothing," said Mena Grace, 22, an engineer in Alexandria. Grace, a Copt, recalled how members of one extremist group defaced a picture of the Coptic pope by stepping all over it in public.

"Now Egyptians are doing the same thing with Mubarak's picture," Grace said. "It's like God is getting even with him."

Does he want Mubarak to leave?

"No, stay," Grace said. "He's better than anyone else."
 
 
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Is this another Microcosm for 2011-12
 
___________________________________________________ 
Food Prices Hit Record High, Respite Unlikely
 
Reuters
05 February 2011 08:28:37 Oman Time

 
MILAN/WASHINGTON: Global food prices tracked by a United Nations agency hit their highest level on record in January, a problem set to worsen after a massive snowstorm in the United States and floods in Australia.
The UN said on Thursday its Food and Agriculture Organisation (FAO) Food Price Index rose for the seventh month in a row to reach 231 in January, topping the peak of 224.1 last seen in June 2008. It is the highest level the index has reached since records began in 1990.
“These high prices are likely to persist in the months to come,” FAO economist and grains expert Abdolreza Abbassian said in a statement. Wheat underscored the problem affecting commodity prices around the world, settling on Thursday slightly lower after hitting a two-and-a-half-year high earlier in the day. Corn and soybeans, which also have been hovering near long-term highs, also declined.
Global food inflation is a mounting worry for world leaders. It has contributed to political unrest in countries with high poverty rates and unemployment, as evidenced in the toppling of Tunisia’s president in January. That unrest has spilled into Egypt, Yemen and Jordan.
In response, some countries are increasing food imports and have built stockpiles to meet their domestic needs. Among them is Algeria, wary after food riots in early January. It has made huge wheat purchases to avoid shortages, and on Thursday it announced plans to lift a 19-year-old state of emergency in a bid to avert spreading protests.
In Central America, Honduras has frozen prices on many basic foodstuffs despite complaints from farmers. El Salvador is increasing anti-poverty programs by 30 per cent, and Guatemala is considering slashing import tariffs on wheat and is handing out food and cash vouchers to landless peasants.
Supply the key
World Bank president Robert Zoellick urged world leaders to ‘wake up’ to the dangers of rising food inflation, a problem said he sees no relief from.
“We are going to be facing a broader trend of increasing commodity prices, including food commodity prices,” he said.
Catastrophic storms and droughts have slammed the world’s leading agriculture countries in recent months, including flooding and a massive cyclone in Australia and a powerful winter storm that swept across the United States.
Dubbed ‘Stormageddon’, one of the biggest snowstorm in decades dumped up to 20 inches (51cm) of snow in some parts of the US grain belt this week, paralysing the shipment of grain and livestock.
A deep-freeze forecast for the Midwest, the bread basket of the United States, threatens the region’s winter wheat because it may lack sufficient insulating moisture to withstand the cold.
Sugar prices also have surged to three-decade highs on fears of damage Cyclone Yasi would bring to the Australian cane crop. Prices for Malaysian palm oil, a cooking staple in the developing world, hit 3-year highs on flooding.
Big companies have had to adjust to higher raw material costs. Kellogg, the world’s largest breakfast cereal company, said it has boosted prices on many of its products to offset rising costs for ingredients such as grains and sugar. - Reuters
“Today’s announcement by the Food and Agriculture Organisation should ring alarm bells in capitals around the world,” said Gawain Kripke, a policy and research director for Oxfam America, an international development group.
“Governments must avoid repeating the mistakes of the past when countries reacted to spiraling prices by banning exports and hoarding food. This will only make the situation worse and it is the world’s poorest people who will pay the price,” he said.
Janis Huebner, economist at Germany’s DekaBank said inflation partly fueled by increasing food prices could in turn trigger interest rate rises in several countries this year. “This could mean a slowing down of growth in the countries which raise their interest rates,” he said. “This could involve Asian countries and other regions, this would somewhat brake growth but I do not expect a hard landing.”
Stock building
Some countries, particularly where food prices loom large in household budgets, have been building up food stocks to contain prices — and to limit the political and social fallout.
During the last food price crisis, the World Bank estimated that some 870 million people in developing countries were hungry or malnourished.
The FAO estimates that number has increased to 925 million.
“The year 2008 should have been a wake-up call, but I’m not yet sure all the countries in the world that we need to support this have woken up to it,” Zoellick said.
Indonesia, Southeast Asia’s biggest economy, last week bought 820,000 tonnes of rice, lifting rice prices, while suspending import duties on rice, soybeans and wheat. Algeria bought almost 1 million tonnes of wheat, bringing its purchases to at least 1.75 million since the start of January, and ordered a speeding up of grain imports.
On a day of bloody confrontation in Egypt, where protesters are demanding an end to the 30-year rule of Hosni Mubarak, the UN World Food Programme’s executive director Josette Sheeran said the world was now in an era where it had to be very serious about food supply.
“If people don’t have enough to eat they only have three options: they can revolt, they can migrate or they can die. We need a better action plan,” she said.
 
 
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act."   G Orwell
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2011 at 2:45am
This isn't good....

Report: Saboteurs attack Egypt-Israel gas pipeline

www.ynetnews.com

    Saboteurs blew up a pipeline that runs through Egypt's North Sinai and supplies gas to Israel, state television reported on Saturday, although it was not immediately clear what impact the blast had on gas flows.

(visit the link for the full news article)
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