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Does Wuhan feel different somehow?

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arirish View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Does Wuhan feel different somehow?
    Posted: January 22 2020 at 11:24pm
Does Wuhan feel different somehow?

When's the last time a country quarantined a city of 11 million?

I watch the news and the first responder's and medical personnel look more like they're dealing with Ebola than a Corona virus!

For bird flu it took authorities more than a year to shut down wet markets! Wuhan's is shut down days after the first reports!

Hong Kong reports it's first case and is already setting up quarantine camps!

Either they are over reacting or they're hiding something!   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pheasant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 2:56am
   It does feel different, I am thoroughly amazed at the speed the normally glacial Chinese Government has moved, or the fortitude they have shown to make tough decisions like this.

   I don't believe for a second the Chinese gov. is over reacting, rather they are going beyond, and outside of their comfort zone based on whatever information they have.

   The magnitude, and political consequences of shutting down an 11 million population city (Now 2 additional city's totaling another 7 million) is so far off the chart its breathtaking.

   

   
    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 3:38am
I think it's a bit late to stop people travelling,

Given first cases where around 1 January,you can

Take a punt and say incubation is about 2/3 weeks,

which means this virus was out of the box before Christmas

So alot of people have been in contact with it......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EdwinSm, Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 3:39am
Originally posted by pheasant pheasant wrote:


   The magnitude, and political consequences of shutting down an 11 million population city (Now 2 additional city's totaling another 7 million) is so far off the chart its breathtaking.

    


Yes, this is so far off the charts of previous response.

It has me scared...we are way out in the countryside so it will take its time to reach us, but if it reaches the main cities here then supplies are likely to be disrupted.    Seriously looking at my stock levels of food and supplies.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Whoo? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 2:48pm
When comes to supplies, how many items such as PPE, is only manufactured in China? If there is an increased demand world wide will a hobbled Chinese manufacturing system be able to keep up? We may see shortages real early.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 2:56pm
Best guess of the experts (and it IS a guess) is that the incubation period is 5 - 7 days.

That does mean the stable door was locked long after the horse had bolted (as if we did not know already from the worldwide cases). But, OH BOY, did the Chinese authorities lock the door!

I still don't know how big this one will be. But I think the chances of it being a storm-in-a-teacup are now vanishingly small.

I've got extra preps in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 2:59pm
I have boots, masks N95, suits, aprons, goggles, gloves. Getting out my Sam's WTSHTF prep list tonight and going and filling it tomorrow before regular people figure this out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 3:11pm
Got suits, aprons, gasmasks. Getting more suits, new boots, surgical masks and new gloves in post (from ebay, within uk).

Lots of meds stored. Lots of food, fuel, torches, chargers, bleach, hibiscrub, viricide and our own water. STILL WORRIED!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 3:52pm
Hey join the club Techno! I just went over my 6 weeks out what to purchase list and I am getting it tomorrow. I am surprised at how much I do not need the list was from 2013 and I have gotten a lot of the stuff that does not go bad like TP. Just have to get stuff that goes bad tomorrow like bleach.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 4:01pm
I ditched all my TP because it took up far too much space. I went with baby wipes instead. They can also be used to freshen up if water is an issue.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 4:08pm
LOL, got a case of baby wipes too for washing up. Great minds! I have a large shed to keep my TP in so I am lucky.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 4:09pm
I went out shopping yesterday,

started getting some supplies......

All very low key....

My plan as soon sit hits Perth ,

Isolation.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 4:11pm
Originally posted by FluMom FluMom wrote:

LOL, got a case of baby wipes too for washing up. Great minds! I have a large shed to keep my TP in so I am lucky.




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"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WitchMisspelled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 4:23pm
I agree with ararish. I've been following outbreaks for years and this IS different. I saw on the news today some "expert" saying something about China locking down cities and an "experiment". What government locks down 11 million people in three major cities as an experiment?

I've already started social distancing. I live in Brooklyn, NY and there is a huge Chinese community the next section over. I'm not taking any chances. Although I think it's "safe" for now, I'm not convinced we're safe for more than a week or two. I'm making sure I have enough supplies to shut the doors and not venture out for a couple of months.

And I was thinking this morning... this is only the first known wave...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 5:27pm
‘This time I’m scared’: SARS virologist warns Wuhan virus far worse, as China locks down second city

GuanYi

Via The Globe and Mail: ‘This time I’m scared’: SARS virologist warns Wuhan virus far worse, as China locks down second city. Excerpt:

    The virus that has infected hundreds in China shows signs of being far worse than SARS, the pandemic that killed nearly 800 people 17 years ago, a prominent virologist has warned after travelling to Wuhan, where the new coronavirus first began to spread.

    Yi Guan, who played an important role in tracing the development of SARS, spoke hours before authorities prepared to place a second Chinese city on lockdown, as local officials employ increasingly harsh measures in hopes of controlling the spread of the deadly Wuhan virus. Beginning at midnight Thursday, all public transport will halt in Huanggang and checks mandated for every person entering or exiting the city of 7.5 million, situated 70 kilometres east of Wuhan. All theatres, cafes and entertainment venues will be closed as well. Authorities said they would also close rail stations in nearby Ezhou, a city of one million.

    “Conservative estimates suggest that the scale of infection may eventually be 10 times higher than SARS,” said Dr. Guan, director of the State Key Laboratory of Emerging Infectious Diseases at the University of Hong Kong, told China’s Caixin media group on Thursday. Dr. Guan spent two days in Wuhan this week.

    The World Health Organization said it would deliberate again on Thursday whether it should declare a global emergency around the 2019-nCoV virus, which causes pneumonia-like symptoms and is believed to have originated at a market that sold wild game.

    Ivan Hung, chief of the infectious diseases division at the University of Hong Kong, said the ability to rapidly identify the virus in patients should help authorities to counteract its spread. And, he said, “so far the virus is behaving in a less lethal manner than the SARS.”

    Dr. Guan, however, left Wuhan convinced that “the epidemic situation was out of control.”

    Most viral outbreaks ”are controllable,” he said. He pointed to SARS, H5N1 and swine fever.

    “I’ve experienced so much and I've never felt scared before,” he said. “But this time I'm scared.”

    By Thursday evening, Chinese authorities had identified 634 confirmed cases, 422 suspected cases and 17 deaths in 30 provinces and regions, including Hong Kong and Macau. Singapore on Thursday confirmed its first case: a 66-year old man from Wuhan. Further cases have been confirmed in Taiwan, Thailand, South Korea, Japan and the U.S.

    The comments from Dr. Guan mark the strongest warning to emerge from a professional who has travelled to Wuhan, a city of 11 million that on Thursday entered a partial lockdown. At 10 a.m., authorities shut down the city’s public transit and barred the boarding of outbound trains and planes.



Source:   https://crofsblogs.typepad.com/h5n1/2020/01/this-time-im-scared-sars-virologist-warns-wuhan-virus-far-worse-as-china-locks-down-second-city.html
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 5:40pm
Shocking footage shows hospital in China flooded with hundreds of patients amid deadly coronavirus outbreak as leading expert warns the situation 'is already uncontrollable'

    The epidemic has killed 18 and sickened more than 600 in mainland China
    It has reached nine other countries and regions, including the United States
    A top virologist said the situation at the epicentre 'is already uncontrollable'
    Another expert warned that the number of patients would spike next month
    At least nine cities, home to 24 million, in Hubei Province are now in lockdown

By Billie Thomson For Mailonline

Published: 18:18, 23 January 2020 | Updated: 23:16, 23 January 2020

Shocking footage has purported to show hundreds of people filling a Chinese hospital to the brim amid an outbreak of a deadly new virus.

The coronavirus epidemic, which has killed 18 people and sickened more than 600, has led the authorities to quarantine at least 24 million people living in nine cities in China's Hubei Province before the Lunar New Year's Day on Saturday.

A leading Chinese virologist who helped tackle the SARS epidemic in Asia in 2003 has warned that the situation in Wuhan, the epicentre of the outbreak, 'is already uncontrollable'.

Another expert in the country feared that the worst was yet to come, claiming that the peak of the outbreak would be next month.

Wuhan, the capital of Hubei Province with a population of 11million, has been quarantined since yesterday.

The local government today said that the city was witnessing a surge in the number of its fever patients and that hospitals were running out of beds.

Authorities have reportedly ordered a state-run construction company to build a dedicated hospital in six days to treat patients diagnosed with coronavirus.

The emergency medical facility would be modelled on a centre built in Beijing in 2003 during the epidemic of SARS, the report said.

Unverified footage posted by a blogger on Weibo, the Chinese equivalent to Twitter, appears to show the corridor and lobby of a hospital crammed with hundreds of mask-donning patients waiting to see the doctor.

Yang Gonghuan, the former deputy director of Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention, today told the press that the peak of the outbreak was yet to come.

Ms Yang predicted that the health crisis would worsen and the number of patients would spike in February.

The expert, who helped fought the SARS epidemic in 2003, made the comments to Chinese news outlet Jiemian, which is affiliated to the official Shanghai United Media Group.


[COLOR=yellow]Dr Guan Yi, whose team was among the first to identify the SARS virus 17 years ago, shared the concerns. He confessed to Chinese media that the situation in Wuhan - where the virus originated - 'is already uncontrollable'.   He feared that the new virus could lead to an outbreak at least 10 times worse than the SARS pandemic, which killed 775 people and infected more than 8,000 worldwide. 'I have experienced so much and never felt scared. Most [viruses] are controllable, but this time I am scared,' Dr Guan told Chinese outlet Caixin.[/COLOR]

The expert, who was in Wuhan this week, claimed he had to 'escape' from the city yesterday after noticing the 'jaw-droppingly' lack of preventative measures enforced by the local authorities.

At least nine cities in Hubei, with a combined population of 24 million, are now in lockdown. They include Wuhan, Huanggang, Ezhou, Zhijiang, Dangyang, Qianjiang, Chibi, Xiantao, Lichuan.

The number of cities is expected to rise.

The provincial market watchdog today acknowledged that the city was facing shortage of vegetables and the phenomenon was caused by panic buying.

Chen Zhuan, a representative from the Hubei Provincial Market Management Bureau, demanded all farmers' markets and supermarkets conduct price checks on their products and keep the food prices at a 'stable' level.

China's central government has also issued the province one billion yuan (£110million) as an emergency relief fund to help the local authorities tackle the alarming health crisis.

The province has also ordered all travel companies to halt its business and cancel all tour groups.

The widespread lockdown of cities happened amid the country's annual Chinese New Year travel rush, when millions of people are on the move every day to be reunited with families.

It also occurred just before the Chinese New Year's Day on Saturday when relatives are expected to come together for celebratory meals.

The new fatal virus, which emerged in Wuhan last month, has killed at least 18 people, sickened around 600 and spread to nine countries and regions outside of mainland China.

Its symptoms are typically a fever, cough and trouble breathing, but some patients have developed pneumonia, a potentially life-threatening infection that causes inflammation of the small air sacs in the lungs.

Scientists fear it may have spread to humans from snakes or bats.

Major Chinese New Year events in Beijing have been cancelled, authorities in Ezhou have shut down train stations, and Huanggang has announced it will suspend public buses and trains as well, following the example of Wuhan, the locked-down city at the centre of the outbreak.   

Footage coming out of Wuhan today shows disastrous scenes, with a man seen disinfecting a neighbourhood with gas, traffic building up on blockaded highways and shoppers scrapping in a supermarket.

Two more countries have today announced they have recorded cases of the infection – Singapore and Vietnam.

In Singapore, a 66-year-old man who had flown from Wuhan with his family on Monday is recovering in hospital. A 37-year-old companion is also in hospital under observation but has not been diagnosed.

In Vietnam, a Chinese father a son are in hospital in Ho Chi Minh City after flying there from Wuhan and becoming ill. They are in 'good condition', according to Vietnamese authorities.

Five patients have been taken to hospital in Scotland and tested for the killer coronavirus after returning from China with flu-like symptoms, it can be revealed.

This means the illness has now spread to nine territories, including the US, and European health officials fear the never-before-seen virus will reach the continent where the UK and other nations are already on high alert.

It was revealed today that an American man infected with the deadly virus – which Chinese officials have warned will mutate and become deadlier – came into close contact with at least 16 people before he was put in isolation.

The World Health Organization is facing increasing pressure to declare the crisis a public health emergency, like it has done for Ebola and Zika in the past. Health chiefs will meet again later today to make a final verdict.     



Source, videos and maps:   https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7921709/Shocking-footage-shows-hospital-China-flooded-hundreds-patients-amid-coronavirus-outbreak.html
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 5:46pm
[It really does feel different this time]

Coronavirus: Virus fears trigger Shanghai face mask shortage

A new virus that has emerged in China has seen customers flocking to buy face masks and sanitiser.

Seventeen people have died from the coronavirus that emerged in the Chinese city of Wuhan, forcing some cities into lockdown.

There are more than 500 confirmed cases of the virus, which has spread abroad.

Source:   BBChttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-51219365/coronavirus-virus-fears-trigger-shanghai-face-mask-shortage
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiMum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 6:11pm
I went out this morning and casually spent another $500 in the supermarket. It was mostly on dog and cat food. I also ordered up 2 more boxes of masks and bought another box of disposable gloves.

I agree that this does seem to be very worrying. What strikes me is the number of people wearing masks but not wearing eye protection. It's my understanding that viruses can get into your system through contact with your eyes. So this morning I also bought 4 sets of clear wrap around safety glasses that don't look like goggles. If nothing else, they will stop us from unthinkingly rubbing our eyes and transferring germs to them when we're out and about.
Those who got it wrong, for whatever reason, may feel defensive and retrench into a position that doesn’t accord with the facts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 6:23pm
Absolutely right, KiwiMum. Any mucous membrane is a potential portal of entry for an infectious agent like a virus. Safety glasses should be considered an essential part of our preps. I stick needles for a living, and good safety glasses with side protection, or face shields, are standard PPE for me precisely because of the risk of accidental exposure.



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"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 6:27pm
I just grabbed some more N95 masks at Home Depot and it was the last box of mediums. Last night there were plenty on the shelves, so I guess people are finally waking up.

"Buy it cheap. Stack it deep"
"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 8:15pm
Dang, I have a lot stored in my basement!!! I have reduced my 2013 list by a bunch. Do not forget the mouse traps or poison the little buggers can ruin all of your food and supplies. I also have large rat traps. Go early guys people will soon figure this out and panic buying will happen sooner than later.

Oh by the way this does feel different because the Chinese are shutting down huge cities...not a good sign. Funny it is not a "Flu" it is a "Cold" type virus that could cause a pandemic. Makes sense we keep avoiding the Flu bug with vaccines no vaccines for coronavirus.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiMum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2020 at 11:18pm
On another post AI posted these statistics a few hours ago

Stats from China's mainland update:
- 830 confirmed cases
- 25 dead (3%)
- 177 are serious to critical (21.3%)
- 34 have been treated, released (4%)
- 1,072 suspected cases

To me this seems very fast moving and I can't help but feel that for China to be quarantining so many cities (35 million people to date) that this disease must be much more serious than they are letting on. I don't think we have the full story yet.
Those who got it wrong, for whatever reason, may feel defensive and retrench into a position that doesn’t accord with the facts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 1:55am
I know I am repeating myself, but this point NEEDS to be understood.

830 confirmed cases now and 26 (BBC news just now) dead, looks like a 3% death rate. But those will all have caught the virus 1 - 2 weeks ago when the tally of sufferers was 59. That is a 44% death rate! 44%!

They just took 1 - 2 weeks or so to die. After all, the hospitals were not so crowded then and they were able to get top notch care.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 4:52am
China has always had a problem with numbers.   We have to wait until it really hits a non communist country to really know how totally bad this is. I sometimes wonder if China just has really bad communications or knowledge and that is why their numbers are so bad or should I say ever changing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roni3470 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 7:24am
On the news this am they were showing china digging a plot for what they say is going to be a new hospital built for basically this disease. We though it didn't make any sense and honestly, it looked more like a mass grave site! This is definitely different from others just not sure why yet. Wish they would be forthcoming with their news!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pheasant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 4:45pm
I thought this would be the best place to post this.

   ever since this thread was started I have been trying to wrap my brain around how fast the Chinese Gov. has acted since last Friday, and then I came across this article.

   Just food for thought:

   
Virus-hit Wuhan has two laboratories linked to Chinese bio-warfare program

Virology institute there has China's only secure lab for studying deadly viruse
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The deadly animal virus epidemic spreading globally may have originated in a Wuhan laboratory linked to China’s covert biological weapons program, according to an Israeli biological warfare expert.

Radio Free Asia this week rebroadcast a local Wuhan television report from 2015 showing China’s most advanced virus research laboratory known the Wuhan Institute of Virology, Radio Free Asia reported.

The laboratory is the only declared site in China capable of working with deadly viruses.



Dany Shoham, a former Israeli military intelligence officer who has studied Chinese bio warfare, said the institute is linked to Beijing’s covert biological weapons program.

“Certain laboratories in the institute have probably been engaged, in terms of research and development, in Chinese [biological weapons], at least collaterally, yet not as a principal facility of the Chinese BW alignment,” Mr. Shoham told The Washington Times.

Work on biological weapons is conducted as part of a dual civilian-military research and is “definitely covert,” he said in an email.

Mr. Shoham holds a doctorate in medical microbiology. From 1970 to 1991 he was a senior analyst with Israeli military intelligence for biological and chemical warfare in the Middle East and worldwide, holding the rank of lieutenant colonel.

China in the past has denied having any offensive biological weapons. The State Department, in a report last year, said it suspects China has engaged in covert biological warfare work.

A Chinese Embassy spokesman did not return an email seeking comment.

Chinese authorities so far have said the origin of the coronavirus that has killed scores and infected hundreds in in central Hubei Province is not known.

Gao Fu, director of the Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention, told state-controlled media initial signs as of Thursday indicated the virus originated from wild animals sold at a seafood market in Wuhan.

One ominous sign, said a U.S. official, is the that false rumors since the outbreak began several weeks ago have begun circulating on the Chinese Internet claiming the virus is part of a U.S. conspiracy to spread germ weapons.

That could indicate China is preparing propaganda outlets to counter future charges the new virus escaped from one of Wuhan’s civilian or defense research laboratories.

The World Health Organization is calling the microbe novel coronavirus 2019-nCoV. At a meeting in Geneva Thursday, the organization stopped short of declaring a Public Health Emergency of International Concern.

The virus outbreak causes pneumonia-like symptoms and prompted China to deploy military forces to Wuhan this week in a bid to halt the spread. All travel out of the city of 11 million people was halted.

The Wuhan institute has studied coronaviruses in the past, including the including the strain that causes Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome, or SARS, H5N1 influenza virus, Japanese encephalitis, and dengue. Researchers at the institute also studied the germ that causes anthrax – a biological agent once developed in Russia.

“Coronaviruses (particularly SARS) have been studied in the institute and are probably held therein,” he said. “SARS is included within the Chinese BW program, at large, and is dealt with in several pertinent facilities.”

It is not known if the institute’s array of coronaviruses are specifically included in biological weapons program but it is possible, he said.

Asked if the new coronavirus may have leaked, Mr. Shoham said: “In principle, outward virus infiltration might take place either as leakage or as an indoor unnoticed infection of a person that normally went out of the concerned facility. This could have been the case with the Wuhan Institute of Virology, but so far there isn’t evidence or indication for such incident.”

After researchers sequence of the genome of the new coronavirus it might be possible to determine or suggest its origin or source.

Mr. Shoham, now with the Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies at Bar Ilan University in Israel, said the virology institute is the only declared site in China known as P4 for Pathogen Level 4, a status indicating it uses the strictest safety standards to prevent the spread of the most dangerous and exotic microbes being studied.

The former Israeli military intelligence doctor also said suspicions were raised about the Wuhan Institute of Virology when a group of Chinese virologists working in Canada improperly sent samples to China of what he said were some of the deadliest viruses on earth, including the Ebola virus.

In a July article in the journal Institute for Defence Studies and Analyses, Mr. Shoham said the Wuhan institute was one of four Chinese laboratories engaged in some aspects of the biological weapons development.

He identified the secure Wuhan National Biosafety Laboratory at the institute as engaged in research on the Ebola, Nipah, and Crimean-Congo hemorrhagic fever viruses.

The Wuhan virology institute is under the Chinese Academy of Sciences. But certain laboratories within it “have linkage with the PLA or BW-related elements within the Chinese defense establishment,” he said.

In 1993, China declared a second facility, the Wuhan Institute of Biological Products, as one of eight biological warfare research facilities covered by the Biological Weapons Convention (BWC) which China joined in 1985.

The Wuhan Institute of Biological Products is a civilian facility but is linked to the Chinese defense establishment, and has been regarded to be involved in the Chinese BW program, Mr. Shoham said.

China’s vaccine against SARS is probably produced there.

“This means the SARS virus is held and propagated there, but it is not a new coronavirus, unless the wild type has been modified, which is not known and cannot be speculated at the moment,” he said.

The annual State Department report on arms treaty compliance stated last year that China engaged in activities that could support biological warfare.

“Information indicates that the People’s Republic of China engaged during the reporting period in biological activities with potential dual-use applications, which raises concerns regarding its compliance with the BWC,” the report said, adding that the United States suspects China failed to eliminate its biological warfare program as required by the treaty.

“The United States has compliance concerns with respect to Chinese military medical institutions’ toxin research and development because of the potential dual-use applications and their potential as a biological threat,” the report added.

The biosafety lab is located about 20 miles from the Hunan Seaford Market that reports from China say may have been origin point of the virus.

Rutgers University microbiologist Dr. Richard Ebright told London’s Daily Mail that “at this point there’s no reason to harbor suspicions” the lab may be linked to the virus outbreak.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/jan/24/virus-hit-wuhan-has-two-laboratories-linked-chines/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 10:35pm
Techno - I think you've hit the nail on the head! We're only 25 days into this mess, which if the seven day incubation period is correct means, we are only three periods in and already have over 1,000 known cases and in three weeks it's in a half dozen countries: Do the math! I'm seeing predictions of 250,000 cases in 14-21 days! This thing is terrifying!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 11:30pm
The size and geographic spread at this stage are mind boggling. This doesn’t feel like any other outbreak I’ve experienced.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2020 at 11:39pm
My problem is with spread too and then there is no know way to fight the Coronavirus. I may be at ground zero soon a family is coming back from China at my work in two weeks.

Anyone coming from China should be quarantined for 3 weeks at home with 24 hour guard to make sure they stay home. Cheaper than thousands sick and dying.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2020 at 12:26am
FluMom- I'm not saying I disagree with you but I'm not sure anyone in our country has the authority to order that! I don't think the Constitution allows such broad powers! After all this isn't a communist regime! Maybe under martial law with the suspension of habeas corpus and posse comitatus but that would be pressing it!

Chuck- can you help on this subject?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2020 at 1:33am
I think given certain conditions ,

the Government can do anything....

Any Governments.....
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