This is old 7/3/07 but an interesting read.

    Bernard Kerik Building Nuke Proof Complex in Jordan
JULY 03, 2007

GLENN BECK PROGRAM
BEGIN TRANSCRIPT

GLENN: I want to go to Bernard Kerik. He was the commissioner of police here in New York City during 9/11. He had some problems. He's trying to get his life back in order. He's spending a lot of time now in Jordan. He is overseeing a bombproof, I mean ready for a Ground Zero nuclear strike. This enormous complex. It's kind of like what we have buried in our mountains and it's, I believe, the first of its kind in the Middle East, at least I bet out of Israel. I bet Israel has something like this, but he's building this, and we had a conversation yesterday about what's coming and what people aren't paying attention to and the spectacular hit. We had him on television last night. I wanted to spend a little more time with him now. Hey, Bernie, how are you, sir?

Kerik: Hi, Glenn, how are you?

GLENN: I'm good. I'm good. Let's pick it up with, what is it that Jordan is doing that the rest of the Middle East isn't doing? I mean, I hate the fact that we're in bed with people like Saudi Arabia and Egypt, but Jordan is kind of a different place. Is that, is that accurate to say?

Kerik: Well, I think it is, especially for the Arab region and the Gulf states. It's different because they have a very aggressive and active role in combating terror. The government of Jordan, the king of Jordan is probably one of our closest allies, a legitimate ally to this country, and basically they're fighting the same war, you know, against radical Islamics that we are, and they understand our fight, they understand our battle and the king of Jordan and the government there is, you know, putting together initiatives and programs to not only fight it internally but also to work with outside governments and agencies, international agencies to combat it as well.

GLENN: Would it be to our advantage to send this doctor that they say they have now over in London that is a Jordanian citizen, would it be to our advantage to send him back home for questioning?

Kerik: Well, listen, Glenn. The Jordanians, not only the Jordanians but a number of different countries outside the scope of the U.S. and the U.K., they have different programs and different initiatives when it comes to interrogation, interviews, questioning, the holding of people. You know, when they commit acts like this or they attempt to commit acts like this, they're much more aggressive. They live in a very different world than we do. We're only coming into play now to getting to know and understanding the enemy, and I personally didn't think that the people in this country don't really understand the enemy yet. They do. They've been fighting this enemy for years, they understand it, they know it and they know it has to be done when they are combating it. So their initiatives in their program are somewhat different than ours.

GLENN: So then tell me, Bernie, what it is that we don't know that they do. People are shocked and I'm so surprised. It shows me how far behind the American people are in understanding what we're facing. When people say they're doctors, these were doctors that were involved, you know, over the weekend.

Kerik: You know what, Glenn, that's only because people don't pay attention. You know, we have a very short, you know, span on reality in this country. We like to put the negative behind us. We like to put, you know, just put the negative in the rear and move forward and forget about the past. The reality is Zawahiri who is the number two guy in Al-Qaeda, he's a doctor. Osama Bin Laden was an engineer. The 19 guys that flew the planes into the towers, into Shanksville, into the Pentagon, these were all educated men. For anybody to look at these guys today in the U.K. and say, oh, my God, they're doctors, where have you been for the last six years, eight years, ten years? You know, there is no specific one thing, one profile about education. You know, a lot of people say, well, it's mostly the poverty stricken. That's not true. There's one thing and one thing only that makes these people different than anybody else and that is their ideology and their hatred for the West. That's it. That's it. I don't care where they went to school, how educated they are, poverty school, live in Gaza, live in Jordan, live in the U.K. They hate the West, they have their own religious beliefs, they are sick and demented religious beliefs and anybody that does not believe like they do or believe the same beliefs they do, they believe in their mind they have the right to kill them.

GLENN: So, you know, I think there were a couple of things that were exposed this weekend, and again most people won't pay attention to it, and one of those is that terror causes poverty, not the other way around. My eyes, I mean, blood shooting out of my eyes after September 11th when people said, well, it's just that these people are poor. No, it's not that they're poor. No, it has nothing to do with poverty. That is a way they can -- the leaders can exploit those underneath, but it is --

Kerik: That's how they exploit it and that's how they promote it

GLENN: Exactly right.

Kerik: The reality is it's not necessarily true.

GLENN: It's not the cause of terror. The other thing is I just met with one of the TV producers, a highly educated man, highly smart man. And he said to me, Glenn, this a new tactic? Is this the new face of Al-Queda and terror, these doctors? And I said, it is the same face. How do you get this across that this, that nothing has changed here except your understanding?

Kerik: Yeah, the only thing that's changed, Glenn, is the different motives and methods by which they are going to attack the West. Keep in mind, you know, we've done an enormous amount to prevent attacks, you know, in the airline industry, in the aviation industry. You know, we're working on initiatives to promote our critical infrastructure, our maritime facilities, our oil refineries. At the end of the day Al-Qaeda follows every move we make, they follow every news show, they watch what we do, and they have to come up with different methods by which to attack us, and everybody's -- you know, they're talking over the last two or three days about this spectacular chatter that they are hearing in the intelligence industry. The reality is, what if tomorrow, tomorrow morning 19 guys just like on September 11th, what if they got and split up into four groups and they went into four schools in our country, one in Orlando, one in last, one in New York, L.A., one in New York and one in Chicago and they massacred 250 kids like they did in Beshawn, Washington? What if they did that tomorrow morning? You know what it would do to our economic system, our tourism, our airline industry? It would cripple this country for a substantial period of time. We don't have the stomach for this. This isn't Israel, this isn't Jordan, this isn't the Middle East.

The reality is they are now coming up with different methods to attack us. They can create spectacular not by flying planes into towers, not by doing things like they have talked about in the past. They come up with a coordinated effort, communicate that effort and get it out to their people and commit strikes like that on a coordinated effort. You know, we're going to be hurting.

GLENN: Okay. So why haven't they done that?

Kerik: Honestly I think now you are going to see that, especially after the U.K. They haven't been able to do it. We've foiled a number of attacks that we know about, you know, the JFK plot, the Fort Dix plot and others. There's a number that you don't hear about. The FBI, the CIA, the Department of Justice, they are doing a much better job today in collecting, in analyzing that intelligence. Are they perfect? No, but they are doing a much better job than on September 10th, '01. The reality is you are not going to stop every event. They will slip through the cracks and they will do eventually what I'm saying.

GLENN: If you are somebody who watches this stuff like I am, you have noticed that there have been -- there's just been an increase of those that have been foiled. For instance, I mean, you just name them. They are ramping up. Is this -- how connected is this to them smelling our blood in the water over in the Middle East?

Kerik: Well, it's a little bit of everything. You know, you say you're paying attention to it here. Keep in mind around the world terrorists, you know, radical Islamic attacks have increased by 25%, if not more, over the last year alone. 25% over the last year.

GLENN: Hang on. Let me stop you here for a second because there will be those who say, well, that's George Bush in this war.

Kerik: Has nothing to do with George Bush and the war. Listen, what were we doing on September 10th of '01? September 10th of '01, we weren't in Iraq, we weren't in Afghanistan, we weren't going after Bin Laden. We had no war foot setting on -- we had no footing in the war on global terror at all, and that's out of the White House, they admit that. They weren't doing anything and we suffered the biggest, most substantial terror attack in world history. So I don't want to hear about Iraq and Afghanistan and the war. The reality is we need Iraq to stabilize because we need another ally in the region, period. That's why we've got to be there.

GLENN: You spent a lot of time -- tell me a little bit about this complex that you're building in Jordan.

Kerik: Well, I do a couple of things in Jordan. I'm an advisor to the king of Jordan. We are building a national crisis management center for him by which he can basically run a crisis within the kingdom, you know, maybe against a terror attack, maybe against a natural disaster. It's sort of the equivalent of a war room for the Pentagon or for a major city such as New York City or L.A. or Miami in the United States. I'm also overseeing the prison reforms for the government of Jordan, and we're building a supermaximum facility for Al-Qaeda types, for these radical Islamics so that they all go into one centralized center and they're held there under supermaximum security so that they done go into different institutions throughout the country and radicalize other people. Zarqawi 12 years ago who was killed last year by the coalition in Iraq, this guy was a street thug 12 years ago. You know, 10 years later he is one of the most wanted terrorists in the world because he was radicalized and brainwashed in prison. We're trying to eliminate that in Jordan where we put all these people in one place so they can't contaminate the rest of the inmate population.

GLENN: One of the biggest, most fertile grounds for recruiting here in the United States is in prison and we do nothing here in the United States. You must have had some conversations recently over in Jordan with people who -- I mean, they must look at us on this particular case and say, you guys just don't get it because they're so -- they've been living with it for so long. What is the main thing that you've heard that they just, they look and shake their heads and go, you guys are just never going to do it unless you do, blank?

Kerik: Well, I think the problem is they look at us and they don't understand why we don't get it. And I think there's logical explanations for why we don't get it. Look, in World War II you had a military might against us. You had a government against us. You had government leaders against us. You could see them, you could hear them, you could feel them. We had our people going to war. There was an enemy to fight. Today these people are like ghosts. But keep these numbers in mind, Glenn, because nobody realizes this. There are 1.3 billion Muslims in the world today. If only 5% of that is a radical mindset, which I probably think there's more, you know, people that will go out and blow themselves up and then you add another 5%, that's supportive, that's 130 million people. That's half our population. That's 100 times Hitler's Army. That is a substantial enemy that we have to deal with, whether we like it or not. Whether, you know, congress can get their act together -- you know, you have people in congress and in the Senate and politicians today running for President. They're saying, you know, the war on terror is nothing but a bumper sticker. Well, guess what. You need to send that person to Gaza to sit through one of the kindergarten class graduations where they have 5-year-olds promoting jihad, talking about jihad, talking about fighting the West, dying for the West. Those kids, where are they going to be in 10 years, 15 years? Those are the kids getting on buses in Israel. Those are kids flying planes into buildings. That's the mentality out there and we have to come to that realization.

GLENN: Bernie, I had Mark Steyn on the radio yesterday and we were talking and his daughter was going over to England and my daughter was just coming back from the United Kingdom and we were having a conversation and I'm at a place with my family that I thought, kids, if you want to see Europe, you've got to go see Europe soon. You've spent time in the Middle East. I mean, I've walked through the Holy Land before and I've seen where, you know, for instance the room of the Last Supper. Anything Christian has been erased in that room. It is all Muslim symbolism in there now, and the Christians, when they got a hold of the room again, did not erase that but there is one culture that is trying to erase everything else. How long do you think, just based on the birthrates and every -- and the political correctness and everything else that is going on in Europe, how long do you think we have as these guys, as a real ally, how long do they have before they've got to wake up and pound this movement into the ground?

Kerik: Well, they've got to do it now. You know, there isn't a lot of time. They don't -- you know, this isn't about, you know, over the next five years we want to create initiatives and programs. They've got to start now. They've got to start working. And you know what, Glenn, the one thing that we're not doing that we should be doing, and I recently talked to people about this in Jordan, you know, there are a number of Muslim clerics in Jordan, in the Middle East who are good men, who understand the real religious beliefs of the Qur'an and we've got to get these guys together, to get them out into the United States. You know, a lot of people wouldn't promote them to come to the United States, you know, and preach in our mosques, but you've got to get these real Muslim leaders, the real men, you know, very nice men, kind men, sweet men that understand the religion as it's taught in the Qur'an to come to the United States and come to other countries to teach the real beliefs of the Qur'an like we teach Christianity or we teach Judaism or whatever the case may be.

GLENN: You know as well as I do that there are forces in this country and all around the world that will say those guys aren't Muslim enough and they will try to discredit them because there is a movement that has its tentacles or the Saudi tentacles wrapped all around it to make sure that anyone that talks about a peaceful Islam, that talks about that terror is really wrong and really means it is discredited.

Kerik: You're absolutely right, Glenn. A lot -- and that's exactly why I said a lot of these guys that we would try to create the initiatives with and that I'm talking to in Jordan now and the Middle East to get them to promote these initiatives, there are elements out there against it. But keep in mind, you know, Saudi Arabia eight weeks ago, they arrested 172 Islamic militants who were planning a 9/11 in Saudi Arabia. They were going to hit the refineries with planes. I mean, it was a complicated program to what they tried to do here, what they did here in September 11th of '01. Even the Saudis, as bad as they've been in the past, even them today, they are coming to the realization they've got to fight this war, too, because if they don't --

GLENN: They're toast.

Kerik: They promoted it, they funded it and it's going to take their throne if they don't do something about it.

GLENN: Bernie, thank you so much. We'll talk to you again soon, sir, and stay safe in the Middle East. Bernie Kerik, he is in New York but he's on his way back to Jordan.

END TRANSCRIP