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Tracking the next pandemic: Avian Flu Talk

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    Posted: March 19 2006 at 2:34pm

TAMIFLU: DANGEROUS AND INEFFECTIVE?

Monday, December 26, 2005 - FreeMarketNews.com

If you think taking doses of Tamiflu will help to ward off the impending bird flu virus, you haven't been reading the papers lately. Word from several Asian countries shows that the Roche Pharmaceuticals product is not showing signs of curing those who have become flu-ridden, despite the intentions of the Bush Administration to allocate billions of dollars to stockpile the stuff.

But now health investigator Patricia Doyle posts on rense.com an analysis of the potential side-effects from this medicine, which may make it even less appropriate for consumption. The list includes, in alphabetical order: aches and pains, allergic reactions (sometimes leading to shock), asthma and aggravation of pre-existing asthma, bronchitis, chest infection, conjunctivitis, dermatitis, diarrhea, difficulty sleeping, dizziness, ear infections and problems, erythema multiforme, headache, hepatitis, indigestion, liver problems, lymphadenopathy, nausea, nose bleed, rash or rashes, runny nose, sinusitis, Stevens Johnson syndrome, symptoms of a cold, tiredness, tummy pain, urticaria, and vomiting.

Moreover, Doyle notes, those with major allergies should also probably avoid Tamiflu, since the capsules also contain the following ingredients: black iron oxide (E172); croscarmellose sodium; FD and C blue 2 (indigo carmine, E132); gelatin; oseltamivir; povidone; pregelatinised maize starch; red iron oxide (E172); shellac; sodium stearyl fumarate; talc; titanium dioxide (E171); yellow iron oxide (E172). The oral suspension liquid, meanwhile, contains: oseltamivir; saccharin sodium (E954); sodium benzoate (E211); sodium dihydrogen citrate (E331 (a)); sorbitol (E420); titanium dioxide (E171); tutti frutti flavor; maltodextrins (maize); propylene glycol; Arabic gum (E414); natural identical flavoring substances (mainly consisting of banana, pineapple and peach flavor); and xantham gum (E415). She also lists several medicines that may have adverse affects while interacting with Tamiflu, including Chlorpropamide, Methotrexate, and Phenylbutazone.

The bottom line seems to be that, in addition to there being no evidence yet that Tamiflu will actually stop the avian flu from killing you, should you actually contract it ... there seem to be at least as many reasons for not taking it, anyway. - ST



staff reports - Free-Market News Network
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Commentary
.
Flu Pandemic Unpreparedness - Tamiflu Containment Myth

Recombinomics Commentary
May 18, 2005
  
>>  Scientists believe that if Tamiflu is quickly supplied at the site of an initial pandemic outbreak, it could help to contain the bug for as long as six months or even eliminate it. Six months is about what researchers would need to develop a vaccine based on the pandemic strain that emerges.  <<

Although Tamiflu could contain H5N1, the available evidence suggests that this strategy is much more wishful thinking than a approach likely to succeed.  Assuming the H5N1 infections in people could be quickly identified, which is a major assumption because H5N1 has been endemic to Vietnam for at least several years and there is no comprehensive survey of where it is and is not in humans, there would still be major bird flu containment issues..  A recent survey of ducks and chickens indicated H5N1 was in 71% of ducks and 21% if chickens in the Mekong Delta.  Most of these infections were in asymptomatic birds and now evidence is emerging that pigs in Indonesia may be asymptomatically infected.  It seems likely that pigs in Vietnam and Thailand are similarly infected,

In addition, Tamiflu was used to try to contain an H5N1 outbreak in tigers in a Sri Racha zoo in Thailand.   Prophylactic treatment, combined with culling, failed to stop H5N1 and 147 tigers died or were euthanized, even though Tamiflu was used at double the recommended dose.

Possible H5N1 problems were forecast in in vitro assays.  Tests of Tamiflu against all 9 N serotypes indicated that the drug could inhibit spread of the virus, but N1 was among the most resistant serotypes.  Recent data with H5N1 again showed that Tamiflu could inhibit the virus, but even more drug was required.  However, the supply of Tamiflu is limited.

However, it is the most recent report on treating humans known to be infected with H5N1 that raises a major red flag on use of Tamiflu to control or eliminate H5N1.  Media reports suggest that Tamiflu resistance developed in one patient being treated with Tamiflu.  The number of reported H5N1 human infections has been exceedingly low, so resistance in this group indicates antiviral resistance will be common.  However, because it is possible that the number of non-hospitalized patients infected with H5N1 may be markedly higher than the reported cases, Tamiflu resistance in H5N1 may already be much more common than the one cited case.

Thus, stockpiling Tamiflu may make stockpilers feel that the supplies may limit or eliminated H5N1, but real data, although limited, suggest the containment plan, like the surveillance plan, is not reality based.

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http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/353/25/2667

research
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Points: 622 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thomas Angel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 3:20pm

 

Hermes,

Nobody is going to read your posts if they have to adjust their monitors just to see them.
I LIKE SCARY RIDES
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http://www.sci-tech-today.com/story.xhtml?story_id=1020025NZ CTC&page=1

http://www.sci-tech-today.com/story.xhtml?story_id=1020025NZ CTC&page=2
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Points: 345 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calendula Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 3:36pm
hermes;  Welcome to our forum, hope you enjoy and find our information useful, let us know if you have any questions.
I am not here to reason, I am here to create"
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Thanks cal
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Hello Hermes.

I am a teacher and enjoy research too. I read the posted research very interesting study. Thanks for the post.

I think any treatment for the BF is suspect right now also. I was concerned that the study was based on a limited sample 2 people from one site location. it is my understanding is that there are different 'flavors" for lack of a better term.

But the more important thing I read was that the person with a partially resistant virus their health was improved by the use of oseltamivir.

So wouldn't the inability to detect if the strain was partially resistant, warrant wide spread use of oseltamivir, at least initially at the onset of symptoms? Could the possibility exist that it may be beneficial as it statistically MIGHT help someone versus prohibiting the use of it altogether or even suggesting iffy alternative medical treatments which may insuring death? Interesting ethical dilema. Huh?. -Kevin

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/353/25/2667

"We report the isolation from two Vietnamese patients of influenza A (H5N1) viruses with a H274Y substitution in the neuraminidase gene, which confers high-level resistance to oseltamivir.10,11 In contrast to the recent report of a partially resistant influenza A (H5N1) virus isolated during once-daily prophylactic treatment with oseltamivir,11 the viruses in our patients were isolated during or shortly after a course of oseltamivir at therapeutic twice-daily doses, and mutant 274Y variants predominated. Furthermore, although the patient with partially resistant virus ultimately received oseltamivir at therapeutic doses and survived,11 both of our patients died. " 

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http://www.primesyn.com/

i use this.....you might use it as well
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Hermes, did I offend you? Please tell me how? I also went to your link and it did not make sense. If you wish to PM me I will be glad to talk to you one on one to clear this up efficiently. -Kevin.
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http://www.primesyn.com/

those are tools for me,lab tool,advanced tool.

sorry if you dont understand what it means.
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Points: 22 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote comrade Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 5:50pm
I once read a article that said mammograms caused breast cancer. Does it ever end? I thank you for the information, but Tamiflu has been used for several years now in both children and adults all around the world. Certainly anything that gives the body more time to mount the immune response it needs to defeat BF is a plus. Given BF alone or BF with Tamiflu..... I'd take the latter. Any benefit would be far more advantageous than none.
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No prob, Ivory tower syndrome I  guess. Happy fixing
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white robes................
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http://search.yahoo.com/search?prssweb=Search&ei=UTF-8&a mp;fr=FP-tab-web-t&p=oligo+silver+dna

hope this will help you stormit explain the tools..........
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 7:29pm

That is not very nice of you.    Are you tring to insult me again? First a censored happy face and now this?... In higher ed it's a black robe.   Any further discussions from me will be through the PM. Please review the rules for posting.-K

 
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OMG the side effects of this common drug are terrible, I guess no one should ever use it OMG!!! read list and see bottom for drug
Abdominal cramps or pain, abdominal discomfort, bloating and gas, constipation, diarrhea, dizziness, fluid retention and swelling, headache, heartburn, indigestion, itching, loss of appetite, nausea, nervousness, rash, ringing in ears, stomach pain, vomiting Abdominal bleeding, anemia, black stool, blood in urine, blurred vision, changes in heatbeat, chills, confusion, congestive heart failure, eepression, dry eyes and mouth, emotional volatitity, fever, hair loss, hearing loss, hepatitis, high or low blood pressure, hives, inability to sleep, inflammation of nose, inflammation of the pancreas or stomach, kidney or liver failure, servere allergic reactions, shortness of breath, skin eruptions or peeling, sleepiness, stomach or upper intestinal ulcer, ulcer of gums, vision loss, vomiting blood, wheezing, yellow eyes and skin.

Motrin

http://www.naturalessentials.com/motrin.htm
My point is all drugs have side effects
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 7:46pm
Originally posted by stormriderfla stormriderfla wrote:

That is not very nice of you.    Are you tring to insult me again? First a censored happy face and now this?... In higher ed it's a black robe.   Any further discussions from me will be through the PM. Please review the rules for posting.-K

I don't know: If we take Hermes at face value and assume no guile:

My theory: The "tools"  that H says he/she uses are for dna sequencing, such as to create reagants, etc, for certain lab tests, like PCR's.  Possibly other gene sequencing.  The "info" page is to try to give context to the other page - Maybe H works in a lab and wants to try to validate his opinion on tamiflu?  Lab equipment, web pages regarding it's use, a post saying he uses them, a reference to white coats, ie, lab coats....

Hermes works in a lab and is giving that as a reason for his position?  

However:  Hermes.....if you're trying to say something, just say it!  This isn't the X-files!

 
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i will say it tamiflu is..................you know what i mean
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 7:51pm

Originally posted by lsu2001 lsu2001 wrote:


Motrin

http://www.naturalessentials.com/motrin.htm

My point is all drugs have side effects

Oh, sure.  I agree.  12,000 people die each year die as a direct result of aspirin use, but it doesn't get pulled from the market.    Good thing, too...there are times that I love my anacin!

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 8:07pm

"Better living through chemistry".... that's my new motto.  Especially as long as I have to deal with Virusil, Mini Me, Hermes, and anyone else he chooses to cloak his "silver bullet" sales pitch under.

And everyone please remember.... IT IS A SALES PITCH.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 8:22pm

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060318/L IFESTYLE03/603180432/1040/rss34

http://www.montereyherald.com/mld/montereyherald/living/heal th/14130254.htm?source=rss&channel=montereyherald_health

incredible just yesterday.......my words in the news.......wow
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2006 at 8:26pm

 

 

      TOPICAL TREATMENT.
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