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Online Discussion: Tracking new emerging diseases and the next pandemic since 2005; Coronavirus COVID-19 Pandemic Discussion Forum.

Nonexistent vaccine plan

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jacksdad View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Nonexistent vaccine plan
    Posted: January 21 2021 at 8:56am

No vaccine reserves, and no plan to administer what we have. How does this not at least border on criminal negligence? 406,00 dead so far, and now the Biden team has to start from scratch.

https://www.fox61.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/vaccine/biden-vaccine-covid-19-yale-new-haven-hospital-shortage/520-9021ff42-43e7-4317-a653-f22339f5a2fd



"Buy it cheap. Stack it deep"
"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiminNM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 9:26am

It would be absolutely mind boggling, except there has been so much incompetence nothing is truly shocking any more.

I really want to see the numbers about the vaccine doses though - if they *really* were all distributed, or if some 'disappeared'. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ViQueen24 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 10:47am

I know this article is 6 weeks old, but my local news alluded to it again today as an explanation of vaccine shortages, etc.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/08/covid-vaccine-us-declined-pfizer-offer-for-more-doses-says-scott-gottlieb-.html

U.S. declined to buy more Pfizer Covid vaccine doses, even after interim data, board member Gottlieb says

PUBLISHED TUE, DEC 8 20208:36 AM ESTUPDATED TUE, DEC 8 20206:39 PM EST

Kevin Stankiewicz

@KEVIN_STANK

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The Trump administration declined Pfizer’s offer to provide the U.S. government with additional coronavirus vaccine doses in the second quarter of 2021, board member Dr. Scott Gottlieb said.

Pfizer made an offer “multiple times” to provide more than the 100 million doses it already agreed to supply, Gottlieb told CNBC.

The remarks confirm a report Monday from The New York Times.

WATCH NOW

VIDEO03:48

Gottlieb: White House declined Pfizer’s offer to secure more Covid vaccine doses

Dr. Scott Gottlieb, a member of Pfizer’s board, told CNBC on Tuesday the company’s offers to provide the U.S. with additional doses of its coronavirus vaccine in 2021 were declined by the Trump administration.


The government in July agreed to a deal with Pfizer and its German partner BioNTech for 100 million doses of their Covid-19 vaccine if it proved safe and effective. The Food and Drug Administration is set to meet Thursday to review the companies’ emergency use application. Gottlieb spoke before the agency Tuesday released the companies’ clinical trial data, which revealed no specific safety concerns.


If it is approved, Pfizer’s entire supply of vaccine produced in its Michigan manufacturing facility in December and the first quarter of 2021 will go to the U.S, Gottlieb said on “Squawk Box.” Under that July agreement, the government could acquire an another 500 million doses.


“Pfizer did offer up an additional allotment coming out of that plant, basically the second-quarter allotment, to the United States government multiple times and as recently as after the interim data came out and we knew this vaccine looked to be effective,” said Gottlieb, who previously led the FDA in the Trump administration from 2017 to 2019.


Gottlieb, whose comments confirm a report Monday by The New York Times, said he believes the U.S. government likely turned down Pfizer’s offer because it wanted to make sure it diversified the number of companies it agreed to purchase option agreements with.


For example, it has an agreement in place for 100 million doses of Moderna’s Covid-19 vaccine. The Massachusetts-based biotech company developed the only other vaccine currently awaiting FDA clearance. Johnson & Johnson also struck a deal with the Trump administration for 100 million doses of its coronavirus vaccine in August.


“I think they’re betting that more than one vaccine is going to get authorized and there will be more vaccines on the market,” Gottlieb said. “And that, perhaps, could be why they didn’t take up that additional 100 million option agreement, which wouldn’t really have required them necessarily to front money. It was just an agreement that they would purchase those vaccines. So Pfizer has gone ahead and entered into some agreements with other countries to sell them some of that vaccine in the second quarter of 2021.”


CNBC reached out to the Department of Health and Human Services for comment on Gottlieb’s remarks. In a statement later posted to Twitter, an HHS spokesperson said the department remained “confident that across our portfolio of multiple vaccines we will have enough doses for any American who wants a vaccine by the end of Q2 2021.”


“We have been, and continue to, negotiate with Pfizer for additional doses,” the statement also said. However, the HHS spokesperson said that the Trump administration’s vaccine development program, Operation Warp Speed, never rejected “an offer from Pfizer for any number of millions of doses having a firm delivery date and quantity.”


On Tuesday, people in the United Kingdom became the first to receive the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine outside of a clinical trial after British regulators granted clearance last week. The U.K. government has ordered 40 million doses of the vaccine, which is enough for 20 million people since it requires two shots.


President Donald Trump on Tuesday signed an executive order that attempts to give Americans priority for Covid-19 vaccines that his administration helped bring to market. The government has provided billions of dollars to drugmakers to aid in vaccine development and production.


“I don’t know what the legal authorities are. I suspect that there are authorities that the administration could invoke that would break some agreements that Pfizer or other companies might’ve struck with other countries,” Gottlieb said before the signing.


“But bear in mind, the countries that the vaccine was sold to are our close allies. There is supply from that [Michigan] plant that’s going to come into the United States in the second quarter. It’s just not all of the supply,” he added. “Some of it was promised to other countries after it was offered multiple times to the United States.”


Disclosure: Scott Gottlieb is a CNBC contributor and is a member of the boards of Pfizer, genetic testing start-up Tempus and biotech company Illumina. Gottlieb also serves as co-chair of Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings′ and Royal Caribbean’s “Healthy Sail Panel.” 

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ksc View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ksc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 12:12pm

I wouldn't blame anyone that didn't "load up" on the Pfizer vaccine. I think they struck deals with 14 different vaccine makers, that's over a billion doses...

Right now the US only needs about 125 million doses (I consider the 2 shots for the M and P vaccine one dose)

. The Pfizer vaccine is one of the most expensive and the hardest one to store/ship/administer.

https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 2:25pm

I agree, the pfizer one is first to be available, but not the best.

However, the 'Operation Warp Speed' document contained very few actual facts or figures.  God, did it contain lots of waffle!  That was very hard to read.  

Back when the vaccines were all in developmental stages, various governments around the world bought doses, long before they were sure they would work.  Not because they were proffligate with their peoples money.  But because without a few guesses and the investment that goes alongside them, they could not get  ANY VACCINES AT ALL for their citizens.  A competent government (yes there are several around the world) would have spent a small amount of money and hired a team of experts to make informed guesses about which ones would work.  Then they would spend huge amounts on a variety of the best candidates.  That money secured the doses and funded the actual research.

No one got it all right (except possibly Canada) but The USA got it badly wrong.

Competent governments listen to their advisors, even when they don't like the answers.  Trump just fired them and then lied about the disease itself.

Believers don't need proof and sceptics won't accept proof.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ksc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 2:36pm

You like waffles? Here's a years supply. 

 Biden administration has released its national plan to combat the pandemic. https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/National-Strategy-for-the-COVID-19-Response-and-Pandemic-Preparedness.pdf 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 2:54pm

Enough!  Waffle overload...


Yep, you are right that was a gargantuan waffle.  In Bidens defence, he had not had access to the comittees and quangoes that support the White House's encumbent and some of his base information is wrong (like the imaginary stockpile).  But you are right.  That was a 'megga waffle'.   

It had about the same percentage of waffle as the Trumpian plan, but was far longer.  I now have a headache and failed to finish reading it.

I will plough through the rest........   SIGH!

Believers don't need proof and sceptics won't accept proof.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 2:55pm

I'm about 10% in and it is repeating stuff already said - HELP!

Believers don't need proof and sceptics won't accept proof.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 3:03pm

20%  and a real fact emerges: ". The Executive Order also restores the White House Directorate on Global Health Security and Biodefense established by the Obama-Biden Administration and restores White House infrastructure to monitor and rapidly respond to emerging domestic and global biological threats and pandemics. "  But that means I have to read those old documents to understand what is happening.


No I am not 20% in, just 15%  I found out I was reading page 31 of 200.

There does seem to be a real workable plan in here, but waffle infuses every page.  (Typical Left-wing beurocracy.  Trump's was typical Right-wing lies and obfuscation.)  This might be a far better plan, but I am losing the will to live trying to read it.

Believers don't need proof and sceptics won't accept proof.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 3:11pm

Pages 31 - 32 contained a lot of direction, but I am sad to say I now know how the document is 'constructed'

First it asked a host of questions This took most of the first 30 pages.

Then it lists how the questions will be answered.

Finally it gives the answers.

Unfortunately, it repeats stage one as part of stage two and repeats stage two as part of stage three.  The plan is starting to make sense, but the clerks who put the paperwork together learned their trade waffling to construct term papers IMHO, not writing for clarity.  Trump would have fired them rather than read this.  


Lucky for me, No one dies if I fail.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 3:13pm

I guess Biden is implementing the swine flu pandemic plan ...

..

You know the one Chump should have used but was to arrogant/stupid  to  implement....



Take care all 😷😉



Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.🖖

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WitchMisspelled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2021 at 6:16pm

Starting from scratch might not be a bad thing.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 22 2021 at 8:34am

Any plan beats no plan.

Believers don't need proof and sceptics won't accept proof.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WitchMisspelled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 22 2021 at 6:02pm

That's the beauty of it, Technophobe.  Reports are Biden had his plan before he took office.  With no plan in place, there's no time lost dismantling.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ksc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2021 at 12:29am

From Bloomberg today.

Vaccinations in the U.S. began Dec. 14 with health-care workers, and so far 19.8 million shots have been given, according to a state-by-state tally by Bloomberg and data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. In the last week, an average of 982,739 doses per day were administered.

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